Morgentaler: Changing the debate

Wellll, I have to say that I’m getting  less and less out of the…

by Andrew Potter on Wednesday, July 2, 2008 7:45pm - 0 Comments

Wellll, I have to say that I’m getting  less and less out of the discussion a few posts down. Interesting as it may be to some, my intention was not to spark a debate over abortion, since that is pointless. I was more interested in the question of how — or if — a country should honour polarising figures in the face of deep diversity. Only commentor SeanP recognized that was my intention, which is probably my fault. (But props to Sharon, whose comment further entrenched the universal validity of Godwin’s Law).

Anyway, foolish as this is, I’m going to  try again. Here’s the question:

Given a) the fact of deep disagreement over conceptions of the good, and b) that reasonable people can reasonable disagree over the moral valence of something abortion, is it legitimate for a liberal society to give public honours to polarizing figures such as Dr. Morgentaler. Another way of putting it: Could we reasonably expects someone to accept something like the following: “Even though you disagree with what this person stands for, you must respect what they did enough to honour them”?

Interesting answers might reference the following: Louis Riel, Malcolm X, John Rawls, Creationism vs. Darwinism.

Bookmark and Share
  • http://www.wernerpatels.com Werner Patels

    The awarding of the Order of Canada to abortion doctor Henry Morgentaler has rocked the country so hard that many Canadians totally forgot it was the Canada Day weekend. The Order is supposed to be given to people who have led by example and accomplished great things for Canada and Canadians.

    Dr. Morgentaler certainly led by example and also accomplished what some perceive to be great things, but the operative element in all this is that a large number of people disagree. They are opposed to abortion for various and different reasons. Some may be deeply religious, while others simply feel that snuffing out a young life like that is just wrong.

    The Bible says, “Thou shalt not kill”, and there is really no arguing over this. Whether you are religious or not, killing is wrong. Take another life and you’ll face dire consequences – in the here and now and/or the afterlife. Of course, there are circumstances that permit killing – think of self-defence – but those are only sanctioned here on Earth. The jury is still out as to what God makes of self-defence. Doesn’t the Bible say something about turning the other cheek? Surely, to those who take the Bible at face value and literally (if only they knew a bit about the process behind the Bible’s coming together as well as about Bible translation, they’d be more inclined to apply a more liberal interpretation, if any at all, to the Good Book), this must mean that killing someone else to protect one’s own life, or that of another person, is just as wrong as if they killed in cold blood.

    The problem with religion is that it’s all a matter of belief (or make-believe, as some will interject). We can convince ourselves of believing every single syllable jotted down in the Bible, but in the end, there is no proof – not of the scientifically acceptable kind that could be reproduced in a lab. Wars have been fought over different belief systems between opposing factions, with neither knowing the real truth. On the upside, many have also lost their lives in such wars and conflicts, thus putting them in the (enviable?) position of learning the actual truth that is denied to the rest of us who have to go on living.

    When does life begin? At conception? In the womb? At birth? At 14 when you have your first cigarette and make whoopee for the first time? Life begins whenever people think it does, which may greatly differ from one person to the next. Hence, the conflict.

    Thanks to the jokers handing out those medals, Canada will now surely go through a lengthy public debate on abortion and end up in the well-trod footprints stamped all over that controversial issue after decades and decades of often crazed and lunatic debates in the U.S. Already one can sense a foreboding that Morgentaler’s recognition may lead to abortion being slapped across the plate from which voters will be fed the important issues and policies of the day in the next federal election.

    But at the very core, there is something seriously wrong with this particular award, and it has actually very little to do with the underlying issue of abortion. The real problem is that Morgentaler is considered deeply offensive by a vast number of (religious) Canadians, yet they are now forced to witness his being honoured for the very actions that they so despise. To them, he is no less offensive than, say, Mark Steyn is to Muslims in Canada. Now, there are fewer Muslims in this country than there are those who oppose abortion for religious and/or moral reasons. Still, what would happen, therefore, if Mark Steyn had been given the Order of Canada? What if he had been thus awarded and recognized for the very thing that made him such a bogeyman to Muslims, that is, his book America Alone?

    The Canadian Islamic Congress, for example, would have organized protests in Ottawa and across Canada, with the controversy likely growing into a major problem, very much like the Danish cartoons. Some Canadians in the Middle East would probably be killed in retaliation for Steyn’s Order of Canada.

    Regardless of where one stands on the issue of abortion, the Order of Canada being awarded to Henry Morgentaler proves one thing beyond any reasonable doubt: Christian sensibilities are not only swept under the rug in Canada but trampled on by the heaviest boots imaginable. It is not alright to offend gays or Muslims, but Christians and their beliefs have become fair game.

  • boudica

    Werner, as a christian, I would ask you to refrain from speaking on my behalf because your views most certainly do not reflect mine or that of my family and friends, all of whom are christians.

    I wish people such as yourself who refrain from using God as a means to justify your political agenda.

  • http://blog.macleans.ca/category/blog-central/national/megapundit/ Chris Selley

    I think MarkCh at 10:17am above makes a pretty compelling point. Andrew asks whether “polarizing figures such as Dr. Morgentaler” should get the OOC, but for people who think fetuses are human—a “non-unreasonable” position, as MarkCh says, just a terribly impractical one—the negative ramifications of Morgentaler’s achievements would be exponentially more severe than any of the other divisive honourees I’ve seen him compared to. I don’t know how to even start comparing Morgentaler to Trudeau, for example, because I don’t know how to compare 100,000-or-so abortions per year in Canada to, say, the lingering effects of invoking the War Measures Act. It’s not because I have strong views on abortion. It’s because, to borrow a line from the Simpsons, it’s like comparing Johnny Mathis to Diet Pepsi.

    If Morgentaler weren’t in the mix, though, I’d like to think the answer to Mr. Potter’s original question would be a resounding “yes.”

  • http://www.wernerpatels.com Werner Patels

    boudica,

    Are you trying to deny me my freedom of speech? Just wondering …

    I may not speak for all Christians, but I certainly do for those who are a bit more realistic and educated about the Bible and its translation and evolution, but neither do you.

  • boudica

    Werner, you might want to read what I actually wrote instead of inventing things. You are free to say what you want, just don’t pretend to be speaking on behalf of all Christians because you don’t.

  • Mike T.

    let us posit that it is reasonable to believe that all life begins at conception and that abortion must therefore be almost always illegal, and also reasonable to believe that it does not and therefore most abortions are permissible. All the Morgantaler had a hand in doing is preventing one (reasonable) side from being able to enforce its views upon the other (reasonable) side.

  • http://www.wernerpatels.com Werner Patels

    boudica, where did I pretend? Where did I say “in my capacity as an authority speaking of behalf the entire Christian community around the world ….”?

    The only one inventing (or seeing) things, I am afraid, is you.

  • http://www.wernerpatels.com Werner Patels

    For that matter, boudica, you will have noticed that my article doesn’t contain a single reference to “I” or “me”.

  • Mike Young

    I think my point still stands. When I say milton friendman would not get the order if he was canadian it is because Friedmam is a deeply divisive figure in the states arguing agains (amoung other things) drug laws, minimum wage, universla health care and a lot of othe polarizing stuff. With all dur respect to the other economists posted ad counter examples to my above argument, there is no way a polarizing conservative gets into the order. Not a chance in hell.

  • Sophie

    I disagree- Preston Manning, anyone?

  • Joseph U

    The Order of Canada has this Biblical reference engraved on it:
    DESIDERANTES MELIOREM PATRIAM
    “They desire a better country”
    (see Hebrews 11:16).

    Perhaps a brief description of the recipients deeds should also be engraved.

    On Dr. Henry Morgentaler’s medal,
    one appropriate Biblical quote would be:
    “he ripped open the pregnant women”
    see: Amos 1:13
    http://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=ripped+open

  • Ryan

    It seems like we have two options presented here.

    1) Give the Order to anyone of a certain level of prominence without really passing judgement on the morality of their accomplishments. This will essentially strip it of any meaning.

    2) Give the Order to people who have done things the people on the selecting panel appreciated. This will necessarily mean the Order reflects values that are alien to a certain percentage of the population in whose name the honour is given.

    I don’t like either. Human beings seem to have a need to honour other human beings, but other than that I can’t see a reason for having the Order of Canada at all. Awards and honours simply reflect the opinions of those who give them out. It’s their honour, not ours. If they must distribute these medals, I’d prefer they give it out in their own name and on their own dime.

  • Theresa M

    As a teenage Catholic, and part of the substantial minority that believes that this award should be retracted from Morgentaler, i know i might not have all the knowledge i might need to partake in this discussion. But here i go.

    let me start of by stating this

    “The Order of Canada is the centrepiece of Canada’s honours system and recognizes a lifetime of outstanding achievement, dedication to the community and service to the nation. The Order recognizes people in all sectors of Canadian society. Their contributions are varied, yet they have all enriched the lives of others and made a difference to this country. The Order of Canada’s motto is DESIDERANTES MELIOREM PATRIAM (They desire a better country).”

    http://www.gg.ca/honours/nat-ord/oc/index_e.asp

    In my view, a fetus becomes a human being at conception; when sperm and egg come together.
    when the number of chromosomes in a cell are 46, that is a what i call a human
    “A persons a person no matter how small”
    Dr. Seuss

    let me point out

    “a lifetime of outstanding achievement, dedication to the community and service to the nation.”

    “yet they have all enriched the lives of others and made a difference to this country.”

    tell me this, what entitles him to these honours. a LIFTIMEof OUTSTANDING achievement and DEDICTATION to the community and SERVICE to the nation. does a lifteime of ourstanding achievement mean around 100,000 abortions a year, killing innocent children; peoples future husbands, wives, maybe the person who would have cured cancer, another Gandhi, another Pope John Paul 2,

    how as he ENRICHED the lives of others? he has brought pain and hardship to many women and families. yes he sure has made a difference to Canada, he has brought pain to many people throughout.

    I think people who deserve this honour are people that promote life, that promote the well being of Canada and the World, and that have made a difference to better the lives of others

From Macleans