Categories: Capital Read, Inside the Queensway

Vancouver South Recount: Welcome back to elected officialdom, Ujjal Dosanjh!

by kadyomalley on Tuesday, November 4, 2008 3:26pm - 67 Comments

According to ITQ’s tireless source on the ground, the recount is over and after a full ballot-by-ballot recall, Ujjal Dosanjh has held onto his seat with a 20 vote margin. Whoo! Go democracy! Does everybody feel a comforting sense of closure now?

The Vancouver Sun has the details.

UPDATE: Yes, she did concede, but ITQ has been told that every vote was, in fact, counted.

Tags: maybe slightly less exciting than the other vote going, over at last, psychologically comforting, Ujjal Dosanjh, vancouver south recount, wai young

More by kadyomalley

Austin So

A full judicial recount is not infallible

Good. We agree.

it is merely a better reflection of the will of the voters than the original election night count (by minimizing the inherent error mentioned above)

“Better”? What?

If there was no funny business going on on election night, then it _will not_ be a “better reflection of the will of the voter” because there is _no_ error to minimize.

But I suppose if you believe that the process is flawed the first time round, then, yes I can see why people would believe that a recount is inherently “better”.

Austin
Karol Karolak

Ahuntsic Election Results
http://enr.elections.ca/ElectoralDistricts_e.aspx?ed=1407

Results Validated by the Returning Officer
Validation Date: October 17, 2008

Ahuntsic

Party Candidate Votes % Votes

Liberal Eleni Bakopanos 18,392 38.6
NDP-New Democratic Party Alexandra Bélec 4,276 9.0
Bloc Québécois Maria Mourani 18,815 39.5
Conservative Jean Précourt 4,937 10.4
Green Party Lynette Tremblay 1,228 2.6
Total number of valid votes: 47,648
Rejected ballots: 523
Total number of votes: 48,171
========================================

Preliminary Results

Ahuntsic

Party Candidate Votes % Votes

Liberal Eleni Bakopanos 18,395 38.8
NDP-New Democratic Party Alexandra Bélec 4,289 9.0
Bloc Québécois Maria Mourani 18,537 39.1
Conservative Jean Précourt 4,935 10.4
Green Party Lynette Tremblay 1,240 2.6
Total number of valid votes: 47,396

Polls reporting: 220/220 Voter turnout: 47,396 of 72,833 registered electors (65.1%)
The number of registered electors shown in this table does not include electors who registered on election day.
===============================================
What do we make out of all this???
Total number of valid votes: goes up from 47,396 votes in preliminary results to 47,648 Validated by the Returning Officer, for total gain of 47,396 – 47,648 = 252 votes

Bloc Québécois Maria Mourani goes from 18,537 votes in preliminary results to 18,815 Validated by the Returning Officer, for total gain of 18,537 – 18,815 = 279 votes

Liberal Eleni Bakopanos goes from 18,395 votes in preliminary results to 18,392 Validated by the Returning Officer, for total loss of 18,395 -18,392 = 3 votes

There is very high number 523 of rejected ballots.

Initial lead of Bock Candidate over Liberal candidate goes from 18,537 -18,395 = 142 votes to 18,815- 18,392 = 423 votes still less than number of rejected ballots.
=================================
One would have to ask; why Liberal candidate (incumbent) Eleni Bakopanos did not ask for a judicial recount despite very serious discrepancy with extra votes benefiting Block candidate??? Was it because Election Canada people did everything they could for her???
It would be very interesting to know.
Jenn

BCL, Thwim and Austin, I’m disappointed in you. This is not a partisan thing. Perhaps you have to be in that position (but I don’t think so) of a voter whose riding decides on the MP by less than whatever the particular number that leads to an automatic recount.

The candidate I supported in my riding lost. But I sincerely do feel much better knowing that, indeed, seventeen more of my neighbours thought the other guy deserved a chance. I still think they’re wrong, but I don’t have to wonder if every vote was properly counted–I know it was. Yes, sure, sorry it cost money. But so do elections. We could do away with the whole thing and just have a pollster tell us who won, but we’d never be totally sure the peoples’ will prevailed. I certainly wouldn’t want that and I don’t think you would either.

So give it a rest. When it’s that close, count every last damn vote again.
madeyoulook

Jenn, I think your tweak should be directed merely to BCL and Austin. Have a look back above and see if you agree.
Cheers,
MYL.
madeyoulook

Oh, and Karol is putting in mucho overtime on some ridings reviews. If I get the urge to up my caffeine dose this evening I will take a stab at following the story line for each riding, over and above my tweezer-conspiracy reply to the first. But, then, the probability P that I will choose to pop that stimulant lies within a distribution D such that the estimate p of P has upper limit 0.15 and lower limit 10^-8. English: not bloody likely tonight, sorry.
Austin So

Sorry, Jenn…I’m not being “partisan” about this at all…

Look, I’m not saying that those demanding a recount are kooks, I’m just saying that there is logic behind looking at a sampling of boxes as long as one understands the motivation behind it, rather than believing that there is some evil left-wing conspiracy going on, or worse, believing that Elections Canada is biased..

In the end, a recount was warranted because it didn’t satisfy anyone.

Does that make sense?

Austin
madeyoulook

From Wiktionary, brought here to save those who need the help the pain and anguish of typing:

MANDATORY
(adjective)
Obligatory; required or commanded by authority.

RECOUNT
(noun)
A counting again, as of votes.

Brought to you as a public service with the compliments of
MYL
Jenn

Thwim, MYL is right! So Sorry.

Yes Austin, it makes sense. And I agree with you if that would satisfy the not mandatory recount type. But that’s not what we’re talking about here.
Karol Karolak

Contact info for:

William Corbett
Commissioner of Canada Elections
257 Slater Street
Ottawa, Ontario
Canada
K1A 0M6
Telephone:
(613) 998-4051
Email: commissionersoffice@elections.ca
Karol Karolak

Brampton West Recount Update

http://enr.elections.ca/ElectoralDistricts_e.aspx?ed=1347

Results as Certified by a Judge
Recount date: November 5, 2008

Brampton West

Party Candidate Votes % Votes

Green Party Patti Chmelyk 3,329 6.2
Liberal Andrew Kania 21,746 40.3
Conservative Kyle Seeback 21,515 39.9
NDP-New Democratic Party Jagtar Shergill 7,334 13.6
Total number of valid votes: 53,924
Rejected ballots: 347
Total number of votes: 54,271
===============================================
Results Validated by the Returning Officer
Validation Date: October 15, 2008

A judicial recount was requested in this electoral district.
Brampton West

Party Candidate Votes % Votes

Green Party Patti Chmelyk 3,330 6.2
Liberal Andrew Kania 21,739 40.3
Conservative Kyle Seeback 21,516 39.9
NDP-New Democratic Party Jagtar Shergill 7,339 13.6
Total number of valid votes: 53,924
Rejected ballots: 342
Total number of votes: 54,266
================================================
Preliminary Results

Brampton West

Party Candidate Votes % Votes

Green Party Patti Chmelyk 3,330 6.2
Liberal Andrew Kania 21,639 40.2
Conservative Kyle Seeback 21,516 40.0
NDP-New Democratic Party Jagtar Shergill 7,339 13.6
Total number of valid votes: 53,824

Polls reporting: 284/284 Voter turnout: 53,824 of 108,046 registered electors (49.8%)
The number of registered electors shown in this table does not include electors who registered on election day.
===========================================
What do we make out of all this???
Total number of valid votes: goes up from 53,824 in preliminary results to 53,924 Validated by the Returning Officer, to 53,924 Certified by a Judge on November 5, 2008 for a total gain of 53,824 – 53,924 = 100 votes.

Total number of votes: goes up from 54,266 Validated by the Returning Officer, to 54,271 Certified by a Judge on November 5, 2008
for a total gain of 54,266 – 54,271 = 5 votes. (there was an increase in number of total votes between preliminary and certified results of 100 votes)

Rejected ballots: go up from 342 Validated by the Returning Officer to 347 Certified by a Judge on November 5, 2008
for total change of 342 – 347 =5 votes

Green Party Patti Chmelyk goes from 3,330 in preliminary results to 3,330 Validated by the Returning Officer to 3,329 as Certified by a Judge on November 5, 2008 for a total loss of 3,330- 3,329 = 1 vote

Liberal Andrew Kania goes from 21,639 in preliminary results to 21,739 Validated by the Returning Officer to 21,746 as Certified by a Judge on November 5, 2008 for a total gain of 21,639 – 21,746 = 107 votes

Conservative Kyle Seeback goes from 21,516 in preliminary results to 21,516 Validated by the Returning Officer to 21,515 as Certified by a Judge on November 5, 2008 for a total loss of 21,516 – 21,515 = 1 vote

NDP-New Democratic Party Jagtar Shergill goes from 7,339 in preliminary results to 7,339 Validated by the Returning Officer to 7,334 as Certified by a Judge on November 5, 2008 for a total loss of 7,339 – 7,334 = 5 votes

So it seems none of 342 rejected ballots made it back into valid votes pile, it also seems that none of initially valid votes were rejected at the recount, extra five votes that were found during recount were rejected as well. There is lots of coincidences right there, or is that Election Canada does such a good job that a judge has no reason to question their judgement??

Once again preferred Liberal candidate gained extra votes at the expense of the Conservatives, Greens and especially NDP.

This judicial recount must have been some kind of political statement in the bottle, Natural Governing Party of Canada will not be pushed around, especially by such upstarts as NDP.

Coalition of Liberano Gang and the Court Party of Canada has never been stronger that in these dark days of November 2008.

In your face Harper, in your face!!!!
madeyoulook

Nervously pondering the statute of limitations on dredging up old topics…

ITQ, do we have any news on what went down re the suspension of the ordinary meaning of the English-language words “mandatory” and “recount” in Van South? An interesting judge’s report from Clement’s riding’s recount in the prior election was online for us to enjoy. Has anyone heard from the judge? Dosanjh? The losing CPC candidate? The chief returning officer for the riding? There must have been quite a few folks in the room. Is no one talking?
http://www.macleans.ca Kady O’Malley

MYL – I’ll see if I can get answers. Answers are important!
madeyoulook

Much appreciated, Kady.
madeyoulook

See, Kady, thanks to Google, I bring back to your attention my request to your journalistic intrepidness.
Cheers.
http://www.macleans.ca Kady O’Malley

You’re right, and I do apologize for getting distracted. I’m not sure if I’ll have much luck tracking down answers this week, since I’m about to go on vacation (well, on standby; if anything breaks, I’ll be back) and I suspect many of the people who could answer those questions will be similarly indisposed for the next little while, but I will see what I can do.
madeyoulook

Kady, you’re sweet. But you are not my personal servant. No apology is necessary.

I do feel there could be an interesting story for those of us kooks who actually find this stuff interesting. If you agree, so much the better.

And have a well-deserved break. Happy Holidays.
madeyoulook

Oh, and it’s not like anything distracting has gone on in the federal scene lately, eh?