Maclean's Interview: Dieudonné M’Bala M’Bala

French comic Dieudonné M’Bala M’Bala on why he called Jews slave traders and why he’s running for the European Parliament

by Martin Patriquin on Wednesday, June 10, 2009 7:30am - 12 Comments

Q: Still, I’m not religious at all, but as godfather to my nephew I bring him toys and I call, and I wonder if Mr. Le Pen does the same.

A: I’m not sure. She’s only one. I think most people saw it for what it was: a very provocative humoristic performance.

Q: You are a virtuoso at marketing yourself.

A: You learn it.

Q: You say the whole thing with Le Pen was a joke, but it wasn’t perceived that way in the French media. Was that your intention?

A: You have to properly bait the media, otherwise you don’t get good buzz.

Q: I wonder if you are going to get Hugo Chávez to be another godfather to one of your children, just to piss more people off.

A: That would be less probable, I think, because I’m more in line with Chávez politically. It would be less shocking.

Q: The Wall Street Journal recently said you’ve gone from being a leftist extremist to the extreme right. I take it that your intention is to confuse everyone.

A: I don’t know if it’s to confuse. It’s more to start debates, to make people question themselves.

Q: In December you brought out Holocaust denier Robert Faurisson on stage and presented him with an award for “social unacceptableness and insolence,” given tohim by someone dressed up as an Auschwitz prisoner. Why on earth would you do that?

A: At that point I was preparing another show for which I needed explosive material. Le Pen was done, and I needed something even better. And the most untouchable was Faurisson. He is a person who denies history. So the award seemed appropriate.

Q: So you were playing a joke on Faurisson.

A: Yes. He denies the existence of the person who is giving him an award, and yet he’s getting the award. But I invited him because I’m very attached to the concept of freedom of expression. And again, I got the reaction I was looking for. There was a wave of indignation.

Q: So you are still playing the idiot, then.

A: Of course! It’s a living.

Q: So is it safe to say that your entrance into politics is an extension of your comedy?

A: Look, Sarkozy has shown that you can be an idiot and a politician at the same time, so why not me?

Q: Everything about your campaign is based on anti-Zionism.

A: The Zionist movement is extremely strong, and we need to challenge it.

Q: You seem to be a bit obsessed. What other than anti-Zionism is there in your platform?

A: It’s the hope that Europe positions itself beyond the American-NATO axis. Like Hugo Chávez, it’s a move toward the real left. It is a movement against colonization, for a better distribution of riches, which outlaws any sort of ethnic discrimination.

Q: The French authorities are trying to ban you from running. In doing so, you received more attention.

A: Yeah, the person who said I should be banned was Sarkozy’s spokesperson, Claude Guéant. He said it on a Jewish community radio station. I now call him my press attaché.

Q: It’s like another one of your shows.

A: I knew this would happen.

Q: I understand why they are mad at you, but why try to ban you from running? I think your ideas are malformed and idiotic, but I defend your right to run in an election.

A: There you go. I don’t think my thoughts are idiotic, but I accept that you don’t have to agree with me. I disagree with what Zionists are doing to France, I think it is a very hateful and narrow-minded movement, but I would never try to ban them. That would be giving them free publicity.

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  • Crit_Reasoning

    Brilliant interview, M. Patriquin. You asked all the right questions.

  • Kevin Solez

    Dear M. Patriquin,

    I think you missed Mr. M'Bala M'Bala's point when at the end you called his ideas "malformed and idiotic." Were you listening when Mr. M'Bala M'Bala said: "I don't know if it's to confuse. It's more to start debates, to make people question themselves"? You seemed not to understand his point that embodying extremist positions as an entertainer is an extremely effective way to start debates, to make people feel foolish for the things they think. He invited you to examine your biases, but you did not, you simply gave him your standard rote response to someone who is anti-Zionist. Pardon me, but while Israelis are reasonable people and Judaism is a reasonable religion, Zionist fundamentalists are some of the most dangerous people in the world, easily on par with the worst Muslim extremists. Unfortunately, Mr. Patriquin, you have proven yourself unable to reexamine your view of Jewish suffering as some kind of incomparable outrage, unmendable by any concession, an outrage that justifies all subsequent affrontery. This is the danger of the Zionism that you so respect, that if a people has gone through an ordeal that is incomparable to any other the world has seen, what should be the end of their vengeance?

    All best,
    Kevin Solez

  • Maria

    Est-ce quelqu'un a vu son dernier spectacle "Sandrine"? Les médias se focalisent trop sur son engagement politique et ne parle pas du tout de son spectacle. Je meure d'envie d'avoir un commentaire sur son nouveau show!!!! Merci.

  • Sean

    "but if you look at the transatlantic slave trade, which was legal for 400 years, you see among the traders people who were bankers, people of all sorts of backgrounds, but especially Christians and Jews. To say otherwise is to lie."

    To say otherwise is the truth. Jews were locked out of the slave trade unless they converted. There were a few converso slave trader families in the Caribbean. It's funny how he doesn't admit to the Islamic share of the blame, after all European Christians never captured black Africans, they bought them from Arabs. All slave traders in Africa were Arab or black.

    Don't get me wrong, buying a slave is as bad as catching one. But his attempt to transfer Islam's culpability onto the Jews shows his true colours. An absolute scumbag and his popularity in Quebec makes me realise that everything Mordechai Richler ever wrote about the Quebecois is true…

    • Kevin Solez

      He got the slave-trade thing wrong, and a bunch of other things too. But, he's a provocateur. He made it clear in the interview that he pretends to hold bizarre views for the reaction he elicits. The fact that his bizarre views get under people's skin is exactly his point. He's a 'squirm-entertainer,' kinda like the old Denis Leary or Stephen Colbert. I don't believe for a second that his shows actually promote hatred. He's just hit a raw nerve in society, with contemporary political connections, so people think that you're not supposed to say these things. The fact that he bugs people with his strange views is exactly his reason for holding those views.

    • Kevin

      If you looked at what he said in depth you would realize that he is going after a reaction. He can be considered cheaper than an Indian man when it comes to publicity.

      Think about it, he manages to get free publicity and that is precisely what he wants. By outraging people like you he gets what he wants. He likes free publicity, it is for that reason that he likes how people tried to ban him from the elections.

  • Orest Slepokura

    Dieudonne is hardly alone in appropriating the Holocaust in a vulgar way for cheap laughs. The frat boy comedy The Hangover also uses the Holocaust as a crude comedic motif. Four guys spend three days in Vegas getting totally wasted. One of them, a dentist, shows the other three a special ring "my grandmother kept [from the Nazis] during the Holocaust". He reveals his intention to pop The Question ("Will you marry me?") to his live-in girlfriend, a real shrew, and offer her the the so-called "Holocaust ring". Instead, he gets royally pissed and the "Holocaust ring" ends up on the finger of a hooker-stripper he marries in a 3 a.m. ceremony at a Vegas chapel. When he bemoans the loss of his grandmother's "Holocaust ring" on the morning after, his fellow reveler – the Dumbo in the group – voices surprise over the fact that something like a "Holocaust ring" even exists. Dumbo: "I didn't know they give out rings at the Holocaust."

  • moliere

    dieudonné is the best !!!!

  • Bloodklat

    I´m sorry, you did not understand what he is saying. He is talking about the people who tried to disturb his Show. There were no Moslem there, but a lot of zionist and others.

  • http://dieudonne.over-blog.com Monsieur Z

    you're right bloodklat

  • Cheryl

    Zionism is just the Jewish people coming back to a homeland they had lived in for thousands of years and had been ousted from several times. It's called Israel. Two of their temple ruins are under the Dome of the Rock. Israel is Zion and it's not going anywhere anytime soon, so everyone should move on

  • francois

    wow…
    Zionist is just a political movement created in response to a huge antisemitist wave in the end of the XIX century, which say that jews should "go back home" (to be simple).
    But it is highly criticised by lot of jews saying that the Torah (their bible) implicitly tell them to wait for a messiah to return to israel…
    One problem is that this simple fact (jews against israel) is everytime hidden, or assimilated to extremism.
    Another problem is that they (the zionist, not the Jews !) have seen in the USA coming to help UK in WW2 their messiah… Eheh. (palestine was an english colony, right ?).
    Arabs and Jews lived in peace in Palestine for centuries… Who is making an apartheid in Palestine are not Jews, but zionist. Please look what happening, and not from some Reuters or AFP source…
    To end, please do not make the mistake "they" want you to make : antizionist is not antisemitism. And also : Dieudonne is everything but stupid, and less again antisemitist.
    (sorry for my bad english)

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