Inkless Wells

 Inkless Wells

Paul Wells on all the latest out of Ottawa—along with the occasional post about jazz. Follow Paul on Twitter: @InklessPW

Categories: Capital Read, Inkless Wells

"We want freedom"

by Paul Wells on Sunday, June 14, 2009 6:12pm - 65 Comments

Something big, and real, and tremendously heartening, has been happening all weekend in the streets of Iran. Watch the video above. The crowd’s courage should put a spring in your step. CNN’s failure to pay attention has not gone unnoticed by angry viewers. Joe Biden is culpably slow on the uptake too. In one of the weekend’s most-read analyses, The New Yorker‘s Laura Secor asks: is what’s happening in Iran Wenceslas Square or Tiananmen? It is a question for Western governments too, and for every one of us as we watch.

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  • http://intensedebate.com/people/jolyon jolyon

    I am always inspired by those who are willing to stand up against the totalitarian state they live in. Fighting back against a government that has its jackboot on your neck takes quite a lot of courage. It's unfortunate for the Iranians that West is run by a bunch of feckless cretins who prattle on about nothing in particular while refusing to do anything that would actually help the dissidents.

    And CNN has prior form, I believe, on ignoring stories that might anger the mad mullahs. CNN pooh bahs are more concerned with keeping access than they are with reporting news.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/robert_mccl6309 Robert McClelland

      while refusing to do anything that would actually help the dissidents.

      Like what, drop freedom bombs on their heads?

      • parched husk

        Yeah it's so pathetic, the same neocons who treat Iran with the utmost contempt and refer to it as part of an "axis of evil" are suddenly eagerly interested in its domestic politics.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/Inkless Inkless

          Are you talking about me?

          • parched husk

            What? No.

            I do think that you're papering over the complexity of what's going on – this is more of an internal power struggle than a popular movement to overthrow the regime. Many of those who support Mousavi are not in any way opposed to the Islamic Republic.

            Over on the National Review blog, someone suggested that Obama should have put out a press release saying something like "Look at your good neighbour Iraq which has conducted free and democratic elections under the American aegis". Yeesh.

          • scf

            Many of those who support Mousavi are not in any way opposed to the Islamic Republic

            How on earth would you presume to know that? There are no polls of such questions.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/SisyphusThis SisyphusThis

            http://www.middle-east-online.com/english/?id=326…

            Mousavi's support is primarily upper class and educated Tehran. Where the media is.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/jolyon jolyon

            "Many of those who support Mousavi are not in any way opposed to the Islamic Republic."

            Connect some dots here, please.

            Supreme Leader = l'etat, c'est moi

            Hundreds of thousands of people marching through the streets chanting 'death to the dictator' and 'death to the government' is definitely a protest against the state.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

            You've probably dreamed up a way to pin the whole thing on Israel. Am I right?

          • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

            Parched Husk, you've probably figured out a way to pin the whole thing on Israel. Am I right?

          • parched husk

            Actually I was going to ascribe it to the Elders of Zion, or perhaps an international cabal comprising of the Illuminati, the Bilderberg Group, and the Freemasons. THat seems the most logical explanation to me.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/robert_mccl6309 Robert McClelland

          The neocon interest though, seems to be rooted in the fear that a more moderate Iranian President would undercut their desire to have a war with Iran.

        • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/robert_mccl6309 Robert McClelland

          The neocon interest though, seems to be rooted in the fear that a more moderate Iranian President would undercut their reasons for going to war with Iran.

          • Mulletaur

            You also no doubt believe, like so many of your left wingnut brethren, that 9-11 was a put up job by the United States. It's all a big conspiracy, right McClelland ?

          • Tceh

            If Brad Wall is an up and coming CPC star it demonstrates just how close to the bottom of the barrel the CPC have to stoop to find 'talent'.

            http://www.canada.com/topics/news/story.html?id=2…

          • Blues Clair

            Well, there is an editorial in Haaretz today: Ahmadinejad win actually preferable for Israel

            I am a wingnut though.

            "paradoxically, it seems that from Israel's point of view the victory of incumbent President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is actually preferable. Not only because "better the devil you know," but because the victory of the pro-reform candidate will paste an attractive mask on the face of Iranian nuclear ambitions."

          • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/robert_mccl6309 Robert McClelland

            The Bright Side of Ahamdinejad’s “Win”

            On the principle of “the worse the better” for our enemies–and, make no mistake, Iran is our enemy–it is possible to take some small degree of satisfaction from the outcome of Iran’s elections.

            If the mullahs were really canny, they would have let Mousavi win. He would have presented a more reasonable face to the world without changing the grim underlying realities of Iran’s regime–the oppression, the support for terrorism, the nuclear weapons and ballistic missile programs. He is the kind of “moderate” with whom the Obama administration could happily engage in endless negotiations which probably would not accomplish anything except to buy time for Iran to weaponize its fissile material.

          • Joseph

            I find it annoying you seem to feel that anyone who even uses the term Neocon is a wingnut. Admittedly, some commentators have a tendency to misuse the term as anything Republican or Bush, which is hardly the case.

            In this case however, it would make sense that the Neoconservative movement, or whatever's left of it, would still support liberating Iran. At least that's what I can tell from their think-tank Project For The New American Century (http://www.newamericancentury.org/), which remains probably the best example of official Neoconservative doctrine.

            I don't know about Robert, but for the record I view 9-11 as a tragedy and view the 9-11 Commission Report as authoritative, so don't bother with that ad-hominen please. It's not conducive to proper debate.

          • Mulletaur

            It's not so much an ad hominem attack as a comment on the genuinely held belief by many people on the far left that 9-11 was a conspiracy perpetrated by Dubya et al. as an excuse to launch wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. These theories have equal credence as the idea that somehow the result of the Iranian election was manipulated in the interests of the United States or Israel and are as odious and untrue as Holocaust denial.

          • scf

            I agree. And frankly, these days, everyone who uses the term Neocon is a wingnut. The term is simply an insult these days, nothing more.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack_Mitchell

            One of those true insults.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack_Mitchell

            "As odious and untrue as Holocaust denial"? Come now.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/robert_mccl6309 Robert McClelland

            These theories have equal credence as the idea that somehow the result of the Iranian election was manipulated in the interests of the United States or Israel and are as odious and untrue as Holocaust denial.

            Nobody claimed that the neocons manipulated the Iranian election. And even if someone did it's absurd that it would be as odious and untrue as Holocaust denial considering there's a mountain of evidence proving the US has interfered in numerous elections around the world.

          • Mike T.

            I think its safe to say 9/11 conspiracies exist independently of political leanings. It's not about being left or right, so much as being a kook.

          • Mulletaur

            Sorry, but my experience is different. All the 9-11 'truthers' I know in Canada are on the left.

          • Anon

            After all we've seen, you guys are still so hostile to any degree of skepticism? Unbelievable.

          • parched husk

            I'm not sure who you're referring to,but I think that such ideas belong to the lunatic fringe and are uncommon. If however you're referring to the idea that the Bush administration took advantage of the tragedy of 9/11 to implement some of their more outlandish foreign policy ideas, thats a different story.

            Similarly, is it so far-fetched that Israel's current extremely right-wing government is not entirely unhappy with Ahmadinejad in the Iranian President's chair, and would prefer him to the more moderate Mousavi?

          • Mulletaur

            "If however you're referring to the idea that the Bush administration took advantage of the tragedy of 9/11 to implement some of their more outlandish foreign policy ideas …"

            That's a totally different issue and is not what I am referring to. The ideas of the "truthers", namely that 9-11 was an inside job by the U.S. intelligence and military services at the behest of Dubya et al. is certainly pure lunacy and just as certainly not uncommon at all. All you had to do was have a look at the signs the protesters outside the conference centre where Bush and Clinton recently debated each other in Toronto to see how commonly held this view is. Left-wing protesters protesting the presence of Bush held up signs which literally said "9-11 was an inside job".

          • parched husk

            Ok fair enough, I"m just not sure why you're so eager to label them "leftist". I don't think they're anymore leftist than that white supremacist who shot up the Holocaust Museum is rightist. They are just nuts.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/PhilCP PhilCP

            I have spent a few hours (more than 5, less than 50) over the years perusing some of the 9-11 conspiracy proponents websites, videos and so on. For the most part they strike me as folks who place no trust whatsoever in government and perhaps even question the legitimacy of all governments, regardless of whether the government of the day happens to be left-leaning or right-leaning.

            I believe that that actually places those folks on the extreme right wing of the voting public, not the left wing.

          • Mulletaur

            Not at all. In the United States, the 'truthers' are a combination of right libertarians and lefties. In Canada, they are almost exclusively lefties.

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/jolyon jolyon

    I am always inspired by those who are willing to stand up against the totalitarian state they live in. Fighting back against a government that has its jackboot on your neck takes quite a lot of courage. It's unfortunate for the Iranians that West is run by a bunch of feckless cretins who prattle on about 'irregularities' while refusing to do anything that would actually help the dissidents.

    And CNN has prior form, I believe, on ignoring stories that might anger the mad mullahs. CNN pooh bahs are more concerned with keeping access than they are with reporting news.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Tidewaters Chrystal Ocean

    I've been glued to the Twitterverse all weekend, bearing witness to what has been happening. Truly amazing.

    • Stephen

      It is fascinating. Still so much we dont know, fog of "war" etc. No sure if the technology is giving us a glimpse into something big or making soemthing bigger than it really is.

      The most worrisome tweet was the one from the University Dorm alleging foreign fighters were involved, Ansar Hezbolalh was the allegation. Once again major caveats should surround anything like that along with some of the gruesome video of dead dissidents. It may be true, and I am saddened if it is. But prudence is a virtue in these situations.

      It is an internal battle…..but my heart is with those who are fighting the Mullahs. The original revolution was an odd combination of the religous and the secular. But the religous side was more ruthless and won the post Shah tussle.

      Well worth keeping an eye on, thanks for fiving it some digital oxygen Mr Wells.

  • RayK

    I think Obama and Biden are quite right to be cautious about showing overt support for the reformist agitations in Iran.

    The last thing these people need is the President of the United States running to their side making them look like a tool of West or allowing the incumbent government to paint them as such.

    We should all show our support for democracy, but–above all else–we should be very careful to make sure the Iranian people are given space to decide their own affairs. If reform movment leaders ask for a show of support from the, that’s one thing; but let them be the ones to ask.

    • Mulletaur

      Ahmadinejad has already said (inevitably) that the Western media are encouraging rebellion.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Douglass Douglass

    I understand why the US Government isn't commenting on the whole thing. They've don't want to be seen to be meddling in the affairs of government selection. It needs to be the people's uprising for real change to occur. The lack of US media attention however is baffling.

    I wish the people of Iran good luck in their struggles.

  • Alex

    I'm watching CNN right now, and they seem to be giving it quite a bit of coverage at the moment. Not sure what it's been like in the last few days, though. Maybe someone told them to wake up.

  • Stephen

    Toronto has the second largest Iranian community in North America I believe, after LA.

    I am sure there are many frantic phone calls tonight.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack_Mitchell

    Long live a free Iran!

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/SisyphusThis SisyphusThis

      Starting when ? 1953 ?

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack_Mitchell

        Sometimes the USA is in favour of the tyrant, sometimes it's against him, but that has little to do with whether the tyrant is the tyrant.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/SisyphusThis SisyphusThis

          Yes. But you chase your corporate tail long enough eventually you wind up with your ass being bitten …..

          http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeq…

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack_Mitchell

            Not sure what you're referring to, if it's not to the word "freedom" having been sullied by American cant. I take American hypocrisy for granted when it comes to almost every abstract, but at the end of the day the hypocrites only win if we concede their right to sully our vocabulary.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/SisyphusThis SisyphusThis

            Well, they did have an election, Jack. Fraudulent or otherwise to be determined and whether we can trust the validity of vague "twittered" assertions.
            So did Hamas. So did Chavez. So did Bush in 2000.
            All mad men and tyrants ? Maybe.
            I'm afraid I'm more skeptical of the filters on our usual sources of information than you are.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack_Mitchell

            Handy rule of thumb: the guys bashing in the heads of old women and children, and shooting in students' dorm room doors, tend to be the . . . bad guys, and the guys who can bring a million citizens into the streets tend to be the . . . good guys.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/sea_n_mountains sea_n_mountains

            good rule of thumb Jack… provided that they are not the same guy.

  • Mike T.

    I bet the quickest way to turn popular support against reform in Iran is to have the U.S. actively support it.

    • scf

      While the government of Iran has a strong dislike for the US, the same cannot be said of the citizenry.

      • Mike T.

        That's certainly true of a larger number than many westerners generally acknowledge. But that particular worms turns very very quickly.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/SisyphusThis SisyphusThis
      • http://intensedebate.com/people/keith_c keith_c

        north tehran is definitely pro-US, but my iranian friends tell me the rest of the country sure isn't, to say nothing of the south tehran slums that are ahmedinejad's support base. Americans, and even a few Jewish ones, have told me stories about travelling through smaller Iranian places and getting warm welcomes, but there seems to be a disconnect with what the polls tell us… The election was probably rigged but Ahmedinejad's support is real. There's a Putin effect where lots of people enjoy the "respect" the guy has won for their 4000 year old civilization and historic dominant regional power…

  • Mulletaur

    People are beginning to lose their fear, but it's not Tiananmen Square quite yet. The BBC has reported this evening that Mousavi is going to hold his own rally, I believe on Monday, after the support rally Ahmadinejad held today. There has been some violence but nothing which could be used by either side to rally its supporters against the other, at least not yet.

    The first demonstrations which resulted in the Iranian revolution of 1979 started as relatively small ones almost two years earlier. The police overreacted, shot demonstrators, and the protests and strikes progressed from there.

    For the mullahs to declare their support so early and decisively for Ahmadinejad was contrary to the expectations of Iranians, so it appears. More importantly, such a high turnout in any election is usually not an indicator of electors maintaining the status quo – it usually means change. It is for the least a very strange result.

    In many countries, particularly those with state run media which have an unnatural tendency to follow the political line of the ruling party, CNN is viewed as the official organ of the U.S. State Department. If CNN has been ignoring Iran, it's probably because they don't want to be accused of taking sides, at least not yet. Given U.S. history with Iran, the whole lot of them from Clinton to Biden and even Hopey himself would be best advised to have a nice big cup of STFU. If the Iranians are really and truly fed up with the rule of the mullahs, they will decide the matter on the streets – actually, Clinton sort of hinted at this in the statement she made today. But that's up to the Iranian people.

  • Mike T.

    Watching Lawrence Cannon near the end makes me so glad that Maxime Bernier lost those documents.

    But even more it makes me wish that Dion had won the election and that Iggy was dealing with this as Minister of Foreign affiars. While I wouldn't have trusted Iggy with the final word on these kind of matters, under Dion's tutelage his knowledge and experience would have made him the perfect face for Canada in this kind of matter.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

      Ah yes. What a country we might have had, under the aegis of Dion's firm hand at the tiller, guided by his vast knowledge, his unerring judgment, his effective communication skills and his competent leadership.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack_Mitchell

        Hear hear.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

    Excellent point.

  • Mulletaur

    The Iranian election results are a lie. From the Times of London :

    "Ahmadinejad also wanted to win a crushing victory in all 30 provinces, among men and women, young and old, urban and rural. He even insisted on winning massively in the hometowns of his three rivals. Almost all the 10,000 people of Lali, a southwestern town, are relatives of Rezai, who was born there and is from the local Bakhtiari tribe. Even there Ahmadinejad was credited with a two-thirds majority. The trouble is, the original results put out on Saturday morning had shown Rezai winning in his hometown.

    Because no fraud is perfect, the Interior Ministry’s website had some strange information. In some cases, it appeared that more than 100 per cent of those eligible had voted. Figures of areas where ethnic minorities live were changed four times on Saturday to show a high turnout, mostly for Ahmadinejad."

    From the U.K. Telegraph which used to be Lord Tubby's organ :

    "Mr Mousavi's cancellation of the protest came as sporadic disturbances continued around the Iranian capital, and reports circulated of leaked interior ministry statistics showing him as the clear victor in last Friday's polls.

    The statistics, circulated on Iranian blogs and websites, claimed Mr Mousavi had won 19.1 million votes while Mahmoud Ahmadinejad had won only 5.7 million.

    The two other candidates, reformist Mehdi Karoubi and hardliner Mohsen Rezai, won 13.4 million and 3.7 million respectively. The authenticity of the leaked figures could not be confirmed."

    At least we know now why Iranians are so angry about the results.

  • Stephen

    All we can do as a country is withhold approval and express concern.

    I am sure there are veiled references we can make to solidarity with those who want free and fair elections.

    What is different this time versus 1979 is there still is a significant core, some estimates, are as high as 20% of absolutely dedicated hardliners who like the society they have, an Islamic Republic.

    Whatever he merits may have been in invading Iraq, doubtful at best, they are absolutely not present in Iran. The rgime willl collapse on its own over time. And something like this reveals significant cracks at home. I am sure the leadership knows that means its attention needs to be focussed there.

  • http://www.TennisVagabond.com Big Dave S

    Why are you bothering us with this when one Canadian cabinet minister has been recorded saying another cabinet minister was afraid to take a lead role on a file?

    Get your head straight.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SisyphusThis SisyphusThis

    CNN has been absent since Ted Turner faded away. But This guy is usually on the scene ….

    http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators…

  • Mulletaur

    No moss gathers on you, nice find.

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