Categories: Coyne v. Wells

Coyne v. Wells on Mr Ignatieff's Wild Ride

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by macleans.ca on Friday, June 19, 2009 5:00pm - 14 Comments

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Tags: Andrew coyne, Coyne v. Wells, coynevwells09, Michael Ignatieff, paul wells, Podcast

http://intensedebate.com/people/Geiseric Geiseric

now I feel snubbed and compelled to repeat (more or less – takes a while to make this sort of stuff legible) myself in revenge…

There are ways to handle the risks of setting (a movable?) national standard. Set the bar to the lesser of a performance-based floor regionally and macro-economically influenced ceiling nationally. Tune as required.

and it IS a good column

and well done again, Gents.
http://www.intensedebate.com/people/Geiseric Geiseric

now I feel snubbed and compelled to repeat (more or less – takes a while to make this sort of stuff legible) myself in revenge…

There are ways to handle the risks of setting (a movable?) national standard. Set the bar to the lesser of a performance-based floor regionally and macro-economically influenced ceiling nationally. Tune as required.

and Chantel's column today is very much a worthy read.

and well done again, Gents.
http://www.intensedebate.com/people/Geiseric Geiseric

now I feel snubbed and compelled to repeat (more or less – takes a while to make this sort of stuff legible) myself in revenge…

There are ways to handle the risks of setting (a movable?) national standard. Set the bar to the lesser of a performance-based floor regionally and macro-economically influenced ceiling nationally. Tune as required. That it doesn't make it any simpler is Harper's problem, not Iggy's.

and Chantel's column today is very much a worthy read.

and well done again, Gents.
Kat

So if people don't care about having to vote, it's our job and only takes 20 minutes, then why is voter turnout continuing to decline?

http://intensedebate.com/people/hollinm hollinm

Going to the ballot box is the easy part. However, if one wants to understand the issues and vote for the best party to govern the country one needs to spend time learning about the issues (not the spin) so they can make the best decision based on their own instincts.

http://intensedebate.com/people/PhilCP PhilCP

So do you want voters to "make the best decision based on their instincts" or do you want voters to "understand the issues and vote for the best party to govern the country"…..I'd say that those two methods are mutually exclusive.

I suppose that most voters actually use a bit of both, but quite a bit more instinct than understanding.

Observant

I hope you two myopic Ottawa-centric jokers read these comments because you might actually learn something about reality.

Ignatieff will be frustrated in any attempt to defeat the Harper govt this Fall because Layton will vote with the govt after extracting some nominal Billion$$$ of concessions for social aid .. and rub it into Liberals that he, Layton, gets substantive results while Iggy gets nothing when negotiating with Harper.

Layton may just decide to shore up the Harper govt to stop Ignatieff's ambitions. In fact Layton may tell the Liberal party that the NDP will not support any Liberal non-confidence motion as long as Ignatieff is the leader of the Liberal party..!!!!

Layton may well view Ignatieff as unworthy to be Canada's prime minister, particularly after Iggy's rejection of Layton's coalition accord that would have already produced a Liberal-NDP government. By rejecting the coalition, Ignatieff is also rejecting Layton … so if Layton gives the Liberals the ultimatum to get rid of Ignatieff, find a new leader who would support a coalition with the NDP, the Liberals would get their election.

Ever think that Layton has the hammer … ya doofus duo …????!!!!

Andrew (not P or C)

I thought Layton "doesn't trust" this government? Sorry Observant, this sounds like wishful thinking. Any NDP support for the government going forward has the unfortunate effect of making them seem incredibly silly and insincere.

jarrid

The Liberals have 77 seats, or exactly 25% of the seats in Parliament. A mere 25% of parliamentary seats. That's not a lot. In fact the Bloc and the NDP have 28% of the seats between themselves, 16% and 12% respectively, which is more than the Liberals. Both of those parties have as much political clout in Parliament as the Liberals.

Stephen

Well if the recent Crop poll holds up Layton has made big gains in Quebec. This would do a couple of things

1) Make Jack more likely to pull the plug
2) Make Iggy less likely to pull the plug
3) Make the Bloc less likely to pull the plug

The question is at what point are the gains or win sufficient for all of the other parties to co-operate. The coalition made sense (from a gaming perspective only) in that nobody lost seats, 2 of the players gained access to power and the the third was able to demonstrate a raison d'etre.

Unless there is something sufficiently odious to drive them all together, either to vote together or revisit the coalition we may well have AC's point of nothing till 2012. Just a constant din of feints and threats with accomodations at various points to satisy whichever player positions themselves appropriately.

jarrid

Good discussion, I do take issue with Paul on the issue of Canadians not wanting an election.

The fact that Canadians presently don't want an election hardly makes them democratic ingrates, or lazy. It may mean, or probably means they're content with the status quo. The Liberals are hell-bent on getting back in power and yet they have little to show for their three and half years in opposition in terms of policy, leadership or direction and party cohesion. For example, on the environment, do the Liberals still think we should meet our Kyoto commitments, want to impose a carbon tax, etc. or have they abandonned those policies. We just don't know. Under Dion the party lurched left, under Ignatieff they appear to be lurching right. The Liberal Party is becoming as enigmatic as its leader.

jarrid

(con't) We had an election October 14th. On December 1st, 6 weeks later, the opposition tried to take power in Parliament. At the end of January, the Liberals threatened an election on the budget, with the two other opposition parties already set to vote against it. This past week, the opposition again threatens to topple the government. That's 3 times the opposition threatens to take down the government, in 8 short months. Is it any wonder Canadians are cool to the idea. It's not like Parliament doesn't have serious work to do.

Andrew (not P or C)

In case you hadn't noticed, our government doesn't have a platform, either. The recent CPC policy convention was dismissed by the government. Their election platform from 2008 was primarily insubstantial (banning flavoured cigarettes and cutting diesel taxes two cents/L–how's that coming along by the way?).

Where does our government stand on GHG emissions? The promised a plan years ago, and it's still just an hazy mist on the horizon.