Beyond The Commons

Aaron Wherry covers all the goings-on in and around Parliament Hill. Follow Aaron on Twitter: @aaronwherry

Categories: Beyond The Commons, Capital Read

Bizarro world

by Aaron Wherry on Tuesday, June 23, 2009 2:32pm - 39 Comments

Scott Reid has some advice for the Prime Minister.

The fourth and final tactic is to make a high-profile beau geste: Mr. Harper should apologize to Quebec. He should go to Quebec City and tell voters in that province he was wrong. He was wrong to attack the arts when they are so critical to Quebec’s heritage, to imply culture is an indulgence rather than an integral component of identity, and above all to attack the coalition in the way he did, insofar as it left the impression that he equates Quebec pride and nationalism with a separatist impulse to destroy the country. And then he should explain, contritely, what Quebec means to him as a Prime Minster, why he moved to respond to the fiscal imbalance argument and above all why he formally recognized Quebeckers as a nation in the federal Parliament.

Tags: Quebec, Scott Reid, Stephen Harper

More by Aaron Wherry

Anon

Scott Reid. The man who turned a successful and confident Paul Martin into a dithering dowrk. The man of "beer and popcorn" fame giving advice.

What's next? Mike Duffy giving a lecture on journalistic integrity?

scf

standard fare from this blog

http://intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

Harper should bite the bullet, appear on Tout le monde en parle, and be as witty and congenial as possible in the face of hostile interviewers. It would be a ballsy move, and if he pulled it off well, he would probably win some new respect in Quebec.

http://intensedebate.com/people/Silly_Walks Silly_Walks

I doubt the PM will be doing anything off script this summer – in English or French.

http://intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

Well, if ever there is a best time to try something off script, summer would be that time, no?

William

Is this the same Scott Reid who said "Alberta can blow me ". And you expect PM Harper to take advice from him.

I would expect the first thing any Conservatives from Alberta would think upon reading about Reid`s advice would be " Reid can blow me ".

http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

Did Alberta end up blowing him? I lost track of the story.
http://bcinto.blogpot.com BCer in Toronto

Well if the guy that said "F*** Toronto" can be transport minister…

Stephen

He can? Who is he?

Because it wasnt the current Transport Minister that said what you put in quotes.

http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

Quite right. The current Transport Minister never said "F*ck Toronto" — imagine the scandal if he had! He merely told Toronto to f*ck off.

http://intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

Technically, when Baird said "They should f— off", he was referring to a handful of individuals at Toronto City Hall who had filed an error-ridden application for streetcar funding. Still, he took the high road and phoned Miller to apologize.
GiveMeABreak

If he had just said "David Miller should f— off" we'd have given Baird the key to the city.
http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

That's true; and this "he said, she said" thing is dull.

hosertohoosier

I disagree with Reid on that one. I think the problem with the Tory strategy in Quebec is that they first over-stepped (selling crime motions and arts cuts that play well in English Canada), but then became extremely timid (for instance they ended up not cutting arts funding, and the "cut" wasn't really a cut anyway). They needed to
a. present their actual record (how many times over could Quebec's provincial government have bought arts funding equal to the "cuts" with the various grab-bags they have gotten).
b. attack, if not mock, the Bloc assertion that Quebecois culture is so weak that a couple of million dollars in arts funding will end Quebec's distinctness. Actually I think that is the most effective strategy in fighting the separatists in general. There are people in Quebec that will never identify with Canada. However, they are less likely to support secession if they believe that Quebec's culture and heritage are strong and stable. Yet nobody ever pitches that message – we either get short-term concessions or schmaltzy stuff like the letters Anglo grade school kids (myself included) wrote to students in Quebec back in 1995.

Harper needs to put some Roch Voisine on his playlist.

MJ Patchouli

Roch Voisine is a proud New Brunswicker (like me), not a Quebecker.

hosertohoosier

So… your father is from Quebec, you moved to Quebec when you were 12 and still live in Quebec?

http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

"they are less likely to support secession if they believe that Quebec's culture and heritage are strong and stable."

I dunno, H2H. The strong nationalists seem to see both a weak culture and heritage and a strong culture and heritage as reasons to secede: with the former, only an independent Quebec can shore up French and restore the glory of New France; with the latter, Quebec is finally ready to stand on its own two feet etc. I've seen both arguments made in the same breath. I fear that at this stage only economic arguments can win over the swing voters.
http://www.intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

"they are less likely to support secession if they believe that Quebec's culture and heritage are strong and stable."

I dunno, H2H. The strong nationalists seem to see both a weak culture and heritage and a strong culture and heritage as reasons to secede: with the former, only an independent Quebec can shore up French and restore the glory of New France; with the latter, Quebec is finally ready to stand on its own two feet etc. I've heard both arguments made in the same breath. I fear that at this stage only economic arguments can win over the swing voters.

http://intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

Scott Reid is regarded as a bit of a clown, isn't he? Didn't his hilariously inept performance in the 2006 election kill his reputation as a serious strategist worth listening to?

Charles

You'd be surprised the level of ineptitude strategists can display and still be taken seriously.

http://intensedebate.com/people/SisyphusThis SisyphusThis

Yup. I think it's inversely proportional.The wronger you be the more TV face time you get.
And it's an international phenomena. Maybe there's a formula.

http://bcinto.blogpot.com BCer in Toronto

Alrighty then, upon further research it was "They should f— off."

Clearly an entirely different matter. I guess we can listen to him then. After all, its only improper to slag Alberta. That's ok, though. Toronto can take a punch.

Egg Head

Clearly, you've never heard of Keith Davey (the most renowned Liberal "strategist" of modern times, who was appointed to the Senate after explaining Liberal election strategy in these terms: "screw the west, we'll take the rest").

http://intensedebate.com/people/Inkless Inkless

Seventeen comments, and only hosertohoosier and Critical Reasoning address the substance of Reid's argument in any way. This new comment software can be a pain, but I'm glad I get to click the little thumbs-up next to h2h's and CR's comments.

William

Oh, I could care less what teacher Paul thinks of the quality of the comments, but I`ll tell him why we don`t "address the substance of Reid`s argument ". Reid is a particularly nasty partisan hack who will have to write a lot more speeches and be on a lot more political shows before we take him seriously. Why analyze the opinion of someone whose reputation begins and ends as a hired gun for the Liberal Party to get as many votes as possible and ta`hell with any principles.

Did Reid or anyone ever think that Harper really believes that it is not a good use of public funds to constantly fund the same groups with their mediocre artistic efforts but world class lobbying for funds and top-notch whining if their are any cutbacks to their entitlements. Harper is a man of principle and I hope he repeats what he said in the last election and hopefully Reid will advise Iggy to line up with these Establishment artistic groups then we`ll see what the unemployed and over-taxed think about that. I think the true culture of Quebec or any part of Canada will survive quite nicely without the ever increasing funding of these elitest groups that teacher Paul so adores.

http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

Come on, this wasn't advice in bad faith. It couldn't hurt Harper's chances for him to try and play nice with Quebec. His problem is that, even if he can send a nice message to Quebec, he still needs an issue with which he can make the case that the Tories are the answer to Quebec's problems. I personally can't think what that issue would or will be, but if I were the Little Shop I'd be trying vigorously to find one.

I'm no zealot for the artistic establishment — one little branch of it has managed to seriously piss me off via three weeks of noise-heavy, unaesthetic Installation Art right outside my window — but Reid's point, which is not exactly News, is that kicking artists around for the fun of it does not play well in Quebec. Surely a CPC partisan like yourself wants the CPC to succeed, even if it means paying a little lip-service to Art.
http://www.intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

Come on, this wasn't advice in bad faith. It couldn't hurt Harper's chances for him to try and play nice with Quebec. His problem is that, even if he can send a nice message to Quebec, he still needs an issue with which he can make the case that the Tories are the answer to Quebec's problems. I personally can't think what that issue would or will be, but if I were the Little Shop I'd be trying vigorously to find one. Ideally it would be an issue he can set the agenda for instead of taking his marching orders from Charest and/or Le Devoir.

I'm no zealot for the artistic establishment — one little branch of it has managed to seriously piss me off via three weeks of noise-heavy, unaesthetic Installation Art right outside my window — but Reid's point, which is not exactly News, is that kicking artists around for the fun of it does not play well in Quebec. Surely a CPC partisan like yourself wants the CPC to succeed, even if it means paying a little lip-service to Art.

William

Well, actually it was advice in bad faith. Harper would look like a complete and insincere fool if he sorried up to the artistic establishment of Quebec and Reid knows that. Besides, it`s hard enough to be a conservative these days and insincere apologies would mean Harper might even lose partisan hacks like me.

And if it means for the CPC to succeed they would have to take advice from rReid and kiss up to the establishment artsys—–I`ll take my chances without that.

http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

So you're happy with the CPC never, ever, on God's green earth, winning a majority? Because the math is just not there, and never will be, for any party winning a majority without those 40-odd Bloc seats.
William

Oh, I don`t think there is a majority out there for any Party, But since the CPC only need a dozen more seats they probably have the best chance. But, rather then trying to squeeze a few more votes out of the art community of Quebec, I think their time would be better served trying to convince you and Paul to vote for them.

http://intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

Maybe you'd like us to address the substance of Reid, then?

Advice to PM Harper: take whatever this guy offers as advice, sir, and try for only a moment to contemplate why the exact opposite should not be the course to follow. Then go ahead and follow the exact opposite course.

No? You no like? Sigh, here comes another thumbs-down…

http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

You can't blame Reid for the failure of the Martin campaign. Delphi spoke.

http://intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

Please direct me to where I blame Reid for the failure of the Martin campaign.
http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

Lessee . . . a little googling and, uh, here we go.

"Advice to PM Harper: take whatever this guy offers as advice, sir, and try for only a moment to contemplate why the exact opposite should not be the course to follow. Then go ahead and follow the exact opposite course."

Silly me, it was staring me in the face!
http://www.intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

A little logics lesson from a non-logician to an apparently lesser logician:

LET 2006 = Paul Martin's failed election campaign;
LET R = Reid is a questionable political advisor (UPDATE: particularly to Harper); and
LET A, B, C, …, Q, S, T, …, Z = the myriad other contributions to Martin's failed election campaign.

A + B + C + … + Q + R + S + … + Z = 2006 is TRUE.

It does NOT follow that:
R = 2006.

Nowhere has it been asserted above that:
R = 2006.

The only thing that has been is asserted is:
R.
scf

If Harper wants to appear like a weak leader who will do and say anything to get a vote from Quebec, then he should take Reid's advice and lose all his remaining votes from Quebec.
http://www.intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

A little logics lesson from a non-logician to an apparently lesser logician:

LET 2006 = Paul Martin's failed election campaign;
LET R = Reid is a questionable political advisor (UPDATE: particularly to Harper); and
LET A, B, C, …, Q, S, T, …, Z = the myriad other contributions to Martin's failed election campaign.

A plus B plus C plus … plus Q plus R plus S plus … plus Z = 2006 is TRUE.

It does NOT follow that:
R = 2006.

Nowhere has it been asserted above that:
R = 2006.

The only thing that has been is asserted is:
R.