Denis, Denis

by Andrew Coyne on Tuesday, September 29, 2009 9:53pm - 108 Comments

Denis, DenisIt was predictable enough that Denis Coderre would resign his position as the Liberals’ Quebec “lieutenant” in the wake of Michael Ignatieff’s decision to overrule him in the matter of who should carry the party banner in Outremont. Indeed, after such a public rebuff he could hardly do otherwise: his credibility was shot.

What was not so predictable, perhaps, was that he would do so in such a spectacularly destructive, and self-destructive, fashion: the political equivalent of a suicide bombing. To claim that he was the victim of a Toronto-based cabal — one that, by implication, also held Quebec in its grip — is a particularly incendiary charge in Quebec, ever alert to signs of Anglo domination.

It’s not true, of course: Coderre is not Quebec, and many if not most members of the Liberal Party in Quebec would prefer Martin Cauchon to Denis Coderre as their standard-bearer. Amongst those Liberals, I’d guess, would be a majority of the Quebec caucus, plus the party executiveand Jean Chretien.

But it would be no less unforgiveable if it were true. He has not only handed the party’s rivals a durable attack line in Quebec, but has grievously wounded the leader he pretends to support. And while this performance has in all likelihood extinguished whatever slim hopes Coderre might have had of succeeding him as leader, he has also effectively smeared Cauchon as an Uncle Tom, supplicant to les autres. All in the space of about three minutes.

It’s hard to muster much sympathy for Ignatieff, or his circle. It was, after all, that same Toronto cabal that conferred the Quebec captaincy on Coderre, in the apparent belief that he would discard the habits of a political lifetime and put the party’s interests before his own. But then, the apple doesn’t fall far from the leader, does it? I’m told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader.

Granted, with more discretion than Coderre. But that’s hardly saying much.

UPDATE: You want to know the worst part of this? It means we have to listen to lectures on loyalty from Jean Lapierre.

UPPERDATE: Good lord, talk about setting the bar low:

Michael Ignatieff is refusing to retreat in Quebec, defiantly showing up at a party fundraiser in suburban Montreal Tuesday night to signal to Liberals that he is still in charge.

Liberal leader shows up at Liberal fundraiser in Liberal stronghold of Montreal. Gutsy.

Bookmark and Share
  • http://intensedebate.com/people/s_c_f s_c_f

    Iggy was playing with fire when he appointed Coderre. I think Chretien was skilled at handling bullies like Coderre, while Iggy might have over-estimated his ability to control such a strong personality.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

      Chretien was (skilled at it) because…..Chretien was (a bully himself)

      Thats not a criticism, just a partial explaiantion for himself. Iggy just bullied his brother, that doesnt work without the family psyco drama.

  • Dot

    Was Coderre slim before he was elected in 1997?

    Yes? He'll now lose weight.

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

    But then, the apple doesn’t fall far from the leader, does it? I’m told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader.

    I remember hearing the same thing. In fact, when I originally heard about Coderre's plan to replace Stephane Dion with a rookie female candidate, I assumed that Ignatieff had already signed off on the plan to get rid of his former rival. There isn't much love lost between those guys. Consider this CTV News report on May 30, 2008:

    Some of Stephane Dion's top advisers are planning to press the Liberal leader in the coming days to dump Michael Ignatieff as deputy leader, CTV News has learned.

    Dion said today he has great confidence in Ignatieff and no one should worry about rumours. Ignatieff insisted on CTV's Question Period on Sunday that he has not been disloyal, saying his job "is to make (Dion) the next prime minister of Canada."

    But some in the Dion camp believe that that Ignatieff, Dion's former leadership rival, is privately undermining the Liberal leader with critical and disdainful remarks.

    Earlier this week, Dion demanded an end to the political sniping within his party after several shots were made at his leadership.

    <a href="http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe…” target=”_blank”>http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe...

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/jolyon jolyon

    "he could hardly do otherwise: his credibility was shot."

    Would we have any pols at all if they had to resign due to loss of credibility?

    I would argue neither Coderre or Iggy have little credibility after the past week's events because the Dear Leader came out in support of Denis before deciding to use the stiletto.

    "Granted, with more discretion than Coderre."

    Boo. Down with discretion, give us more gossip and innuendo please.

    Denis, Denis is my favourite Blondie song.

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/jolyon jolyon

    "he could hardly do otherwise: his credibility was shot."

    Would we have any pols at all if they had to resign due to loss of credibility? We would have different PM every week.

    I would argue neither Coderre or Iggy have little credibility after the past week's events because the Dear Leader came out in support of Denis before deciding to use the stiletto.

    "Granted, with more discretion than Coderre."

    Boo. Down with discretion, give us more gossip and innuendo please.

    Denis, Denis is my favourite Blondie song.

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/jolyon jolyon

    "he could hardly do otherwise: his credibility was shot."

    Would we have any pols at all if they had to resign due to loss of credibility? We would have different PM every week.

    I would argue both Coderre or Iggy have little credibility after the past week's events because the Dear Leader came out in support of Denis before deciding to use the stiletto.

    "Granted, with more discretion than Coderre."

    Boo. Down with discretion, give us more gossip and innuendo please.

    Denis, Denis is my favourite Blondie song.

  • shouldIsellyourwheat

    Disclosure: I don't like Denis Coderre.

    The problem is that Denis Coderre is the guy doing all the hard work for the Liberal Party in Quebec.

    Most of the Montreal crowd are just waiting for their entitlements to flow down from the Desmarais-Chretien-RAe-Cauchon old guard establishment.

    So there in a nutshell is the problem. The old guard, who doesn't do any of the work, and still wants to be entitled to their entitlements, and Denis Coderre, the guy trying to rebuild the party in outside of the safe havens for the old guard in Montreal.

  • jarrid

    "I’m told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader."

    I hadn't heard that but I'm not at all impressed by hearing about it. It certainly sets a bad example for the rank and file – and it could come back to haunt Iggy.

    • dan in van

      Jarrid's tears for Dion now can be placed in the Ripley's Believe it Or Not museum…

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

    But then, the apple doesn’t fall far from the leader, does it? I’m told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader.

    I remember hearing the same thing. In fact, when I originally heard about Coderre's intention to replace Stephane Dion with a rookie female candidate, I assumed that Ignatieff had already signed off on the plan to get rid of his former rival. There isn't much love lost between those guys. Consider this CTV News report on May 30, 2008:
    .
    "Some of Stephane Dion's top advisers are planning to press the Liberal leader in the coming days to dump Michael Ignatieff as deputy leader, CTV News has learned.

    Dion said today he has great confidence in Ignatieff and no one should worry about rumours. Ignatieff insisted on CTV's Question Period on Sunday that he has not been disloyal, saying his job "is to make (Dion) the next prime minister of Canada."

    But some in the Dion camp believe that that Ignatieff, Dion's former leadership rival, is privately undermining the Liberal leader with critical and disdainful remarks.

    Earlier this week, Dion demanded an end to the political sniping within his party after several shots were made at his leadership."

    <a href="http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe…” target=”_blank”>http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe...

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/jolyon jolyon

      "with critical and disdainful remarks."

      Surely many/most cabinet members think they are the bee's knees and could do better than the boss. Bad mouthing is only a real problem if it goes public. If Dion had been a decent leader, Iggy could call him a wanker all he wanted to and it would not have made a difference. Iggy would have been ignored or ostracized.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

      And we already know that SD is has a vindictive streak in him. Iggy needs friends right now….and unfortunate for him the cold embrace of Bob Rae and Jean Chretien is his only protection. They will run him like a marionette until they dont need him.

  • http://theplaceofbiff.blogspot.com biff

    At a time when Iggy is struggling to justify why he should be given the reigns of government, we're treated to this fairly ugly public spectacle.

    Talk about blowing a job interview.

  • Will

    I heard Harper used to say some pretty bad things about Stockwell Day and Peter MacKay. MacKay and Belinda used to place crank calls to Harper's red emergency phone.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

      And when Harper is at his weakest those things may come back to haunt him….alternatively, he has given both those ministers a chance to shine…..so some of the sting might be gone.

      In some ways all political leaders go thrugh trials by fire within their party, even after they win. For all the doom and gloom, and there is lots of it, it is an oppotunity…..but we will see how he deals with it.

  • wilson

    No mention of Bob Rae? No mention of Chretien meddling?

    MI's bff, Rae, who publicly questioned his leader's decision to reject Cauchon in favour of Coderre's pick!

    MI stabs Cauchon, Rae stabs MI, MI stabs Coderre, Coderre stabs MI, Cauchon and the OLO….sweet

    • dan in van

      Glad you continue to support the idea of appointing candidates. Those who dare speak in favour of grassroots democracy should be pillared from post to post, just like that poor CON candidate in Guelph a year ago. Your idle musings will be noted as CON firestarting.

  • jarrid

    It'll be interesting to see if the Coderre affair will show up in the polls, particularly in Quebec where the Libs had been having some limited success under Iggy.

    In question period today, as Chantal Hébert points out on her "blogue", the first 7 questions by the Liberals were either about Quebec or were asked by MP's from Quebec.

    They can suck up to Quebec all they want, it'll take Quebecers 2 or 3 more elections at least before they forget, or forgive, the Liberals for the odiousness that was Adscam.

    • Ron

      If an off the cuff comment on arts funding cost Harper 5 to 10 seats in Quebec last election, the accusation, buy their number 1 organizer in Quebec, that the current Liberal Party is run by folks in Toronto will not be a neutral event. The more they try to suck up to Quebec, the more damage they will do to themselves in the rest of the country and it is highly unlikely Quebecers will respond to this obvious pandering.

      • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

        It seems like a calculated attempt by Coderre to cause as much damage in Quebec as possible. Coyne's "suicide bombing" analogy is apt. There is no way that Coderre will ever be taken seriously as a future leadership candidate after this vindictive stunt.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

          The question now is, like Jean Lapierre, would Coderre be talking to the Bloc……if he is falling back on tribal explainaions it might be the best place for him.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/OntarioTown OntarioTown

            if that's the case, the best thing for the Liberals, and Canada is to be rid of Coderre. Attacking other provinces is not the best way to win over Canada.

            Perhaps this will be a case for really cleaning house and my even end up a positive.

            Coderre is a goon – I don't even understand why the BLOC would want him.

    • wilson

      And this would be a realy good time to table the bill giving Ontario, Alberta and BC more seats in parliament.
      Watch Liberals dancing on both sides of that fence will be entertaining.

  • wilson

    Oh, forgot previous stabbings.
    Martin stabs Chretien, Chretien stabs Martin, repeat many times,
    LPC stabs Martin, MI and Rae both lose Lib leadership race, LPC and MI and Coderre stab Dion, MI manipulates Rae and Domie out.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/john_g2708 john g

    Couldn't they just have demoted him to be the Quebec Private?

  • Calgay Junkie

    Michael Harris talks to Darryl Bricker of Ipsos-Reid, who speculates about fallout from Codere:
    Lib MPs crossing the floor, Layton pulling the plug if Lib poll numbers stay below 30, stuff like that.

    Listen Here

    Fast forward to the 1 hour, 11 minute mark.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

      That was interesting, Interesting scenario, pretty unlikely for the moment….but then again who would have imagined what happened when the Bloc formed. They keystone is someone like Cotler. If Cotler ever moved to be an independent or a Con then the Liberal Party falls apart with MPS flowing to all three additional parties.

      Not saying this is likely, but that is how it would work. That it is even a remote possibility says just about everything.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/sea_n_mountains sea_n_mountains

    well put AC. my only question surrounds his remaining an MP….why doesn't iggy push him out the door if he is so pissed

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

      Coderre would LOVE that. And so would the Bloc.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/sea_n_mountains sea_n_mountains

        As far as Coderre oh well. As far as the Bloc, sure, but I suspect the smile on their face is fairly wide as it stands now. and, the message would have to be delivered in the right manner by the right individual (e.g., 'we do need soem fresh blood in QC'; negotiate a soft landing for Dion because there is no place left for him in the party; etc etc)…let's be hnest , everyone knows that politic is about winners and losers and everyone understands Coderre just lost, even if he hurt Iggy on the way down.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

          I am not saying that Coderre is any great catch in the long run. But as a signal of disrespect it would be potent. There are more than a few of the managerial class in Quebec whose jobs depend on being the interpreter of things Quebecois to les angais…be they from ROC or from the US. Coderre was in that position, I wouldnt dismiss the resonnance that this would have…whether you think it is correct or not.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/sea_n_mountains sea_n_mountains

            while i can't disagree with the value of that position, i just can't beleive that 1) he is not replaceable or 2) that anyone would be surprised that when one loses a political battle and than skewers the boss on the way down, that he or she does not get to pick their own punishment (e.g., resign as lieutenant) in full.

  • Lee

    I used to say shockingly disloyal things while Stephane Dion was the Liberal party leader too. I was a rank-and-file Liberal who supported Dion, to my discredit. Just about everyone in the party was either saying disloyal things or suppressing the urge to during 2007 and 2008; I disloyally quit the party.

    Can't blame Iggy for saying what everyone was thinking and quietly, or even not-so-quietly, fretting about. Dion bungled everything from lack of language study to allowing Harper to define him to focusing on issues the public wasn't interested in.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/OntarioTown OntarioTown

      And, certain pundits at Macleans thought Dion was the end-all and then started to attack as well.

      Harper was pretty disloyal himself – why it isn't talked about?

      Do you not think there are people in the Cons and NDP who are plotting and planning their future as leader? If you don't, you're pretty naive.

      So, we have floods, tsunamis, Iran with nuclear weapons – and Coderre is the headliner?

      Democracy in trouble – the media has to take part of the blame.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

      ANd yet the Liberals wont take repsonisbility for elcting him or letting him run the party so badly there were so many ontervention points but the party did NOTHING, twice (election and coalition)

      Will they let it happen a third time?

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

      "Dion bungled everything from lack of language study to allowing Harper to define him to focusing on issues the public wasn't interested in."

      Really? So please explain why it is that we are saying the exact same thing happening to Iggy? Iggy doesn't issues with french accents when he speaks so what gives? Or could it be that the problem wasn't Dion but rather the Liberals unfailing propensity to turn on each other? As much as I have problems with the CPC, you won't find that kind of public disloyalty among them.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

        You used to….

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

    Liberal leader shows up at Liberal fundraiser in Liberal stronghold of Montreal. Gutsy.

    Well, it was Laval, but point taken.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

      Actually, as far as gutsy goes: did he speak a word of English? There's your gutsy.

      • dan in van

        Funny thing is, the Montreal stop had been written into his schedule for more than two months. Had he backed out would Coyne or all the parrot CONs be offering the opposite of 'gutsy'?
        It's the reporter's own spin that made it seem like Ignatieff's visit was some kind of march into Zanzibar.
        Seems to me the tiff between Harper and Casey — one of them with a well-established reputation for being reasonable and honourable — didn't raise the cadre of overhysteria that the CONs and con-thinkers have tried to rope this into. But I guess if you want an argument about the mythical 'left-wing media' one only has to read how greatly the appraisal of Coderre seems to be now in the heights of this hullaballo. I suspect it suggests that they don't believe Steve Clark could repeat his performance of a year ago, or the RCMP is hesitant to offer up a faux inquiry for the masses…

  • A reader

    Actually, they really need the money in that riding (Lavel-les-Iles, Raymonde Folco's riding). The Liberal riding association there was almost $50K in the hole at the end of 2007, she only raised $26K for the last election but spent $46K, and the riding's 2008 return is still not posted at Elections Canada. This is one of the MPs Coderre wanted to push out last week.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/OntarioTown OntarioTown

      Ya, but that is not exciting enough to go into to make a headline. And, perhaps Ignatieff was also using the time to speak to others inside the party?

      Imagine – Ignatieff was helping a fellow Liberal to raise funds – the horror.

  • Usual Suspect

    It seems to me this "tradition" of apponting Quebec Lieutenants with the authority to select candidates is a recipe for disaster. Can it be anything but?

    Perhaps it is time for rank and file Liberals to retake their party from the backroom types and restore some democracy to the party. They would do us all a favor.

    While I understand the need for Leaders to retain a "notwithstanding clause" with respect to candidate appointments, this power should only be used in the rarest of circumstances, and certainly not as it is used these days.

    Surely a riding like Outremont has a membership robust enough to sustain some good old fashioned democracy, no?

    • jarrid

      You make a number of excellent points and it's hard to disagree with anything you've said.

      That said, the culture of the Liberal Party of Canada has always been a top down – this has been fostered, or become entrenched, because of there history of being in power. The "grassroots". the rank and file are used for photo ops. The Liberal Party of Canada is the party of the vested interests. You need go no further than the recent feud involving Coderre and Cauchon. Cauchon belongs to the Desmarais Power Corp. clan, (he once was a butler at the Desmarais home). When that clan wants something, they go out and take it.

      So although your points are well taken, the problem is that there is no grassroots in the Liberal Party to take back the party from the backroom corporate crowd that runs the Liberal Party.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Geiseric Geiseric

    Taking orders from a boss has sweet piss all to do with credibility and everything to do with the worst form of pride.

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/Geiseric Geiseric

    Taking orders from a boss has sweet piss all to do with credibility. Lots of people do it all day every day. Taking exception to having to has everything to do with the worst form of pride.

  • jarrid

    In the Jane Taber article linked above under Upperdate there's another picture of Iggy's pointing his finger at something.

    I always wondered why in so many pictures Iggy appears to be pointing his finger.

    I think I finally get it: he's gesturing inquisitively as to where the exit door is.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/OntarioTown OntarioTown

      Give your head a shake – out of probably thousands of pictures – they deliberately pick ones like that. They've done it to Harper as well.

      Hardly a serious point.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

        I am more shocked that jarrid actually tortures himself by reading anything Taber produces.

  • jarrid

    New CROP poll out in Quebec and it's grim news for the Liberals. The worst of it is that, according to the pollster: they DON'T take into account Coderre's recent resignation and the ensuing fallout. The poll was conducted from Sept. 17th to 27th. Here's the results:

    BQ 33
    Libs 26
    Cons 21
    NDP 13

    To put things in perspective the Liberals were riding high at 35% in June of this year. Dion got 26% of the vote in 2008.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/austinso austinso

      Hey jarrid, you're making a mess on the keyboard with your self-engrossed excitement…

      You bring up Adscam ad nauseum, but the scale doesn't even approach the what is going on with Harper's Orwellian "Economic Action! Plan". Funny no CPC supporter ever complained about Quebec's tax rebate either…

    • jarrid

      Correction: Dion got 24% last election.

From Macleans