Liberals ready to Think Big

Nice reporting from the Star today, confirming that the Liberal party’s long-anticipated Big Thinkers…

by Andrew Potter on Wednesday, October 14, 2009 10:47am - 66 Comments

Nice reporting from the Star today, confirming that the Liberal party’s long-anticipated Big Thinkers conference is set to go in January.

I’m generally quite in favour of these sorts of things. A political party is the hinge institution of a democracy, where policy gets transferred into power. It’s bad for democracy when a party is too ideological and unwilling to sacrifice principle for power — as was too often the case with the Reform party. But it’s probably worse when a party is so blindly focused on gaining and keeping power that it loses sight of why it wants to govern in the first place. See: Liberal party from 2000 to 2006.

But here’s a caution to the Liberal party. From the Star’s piece, you already get the sense that expectations for this within the party are high, and getting higher by the week. As always, Liberals are thinking back to the famous Kingston conference that energized the Pearson years, and the Aylmer conference that gave Chretien a push. It’s like they think all they have to do is read a bunch of academic papers and the majority governments will beat a path to their door.

But things have changed a lot in Canada in the nearly 20 years since the Aylmer conference. It’s a much different country, and it faces much different challenges. I don’t have a solid argument on this, but my feeling is that the ideological landscape of Canada has narrowed considerably since then. What that means is that Canadian politics is much less amenable to Big Ideas and Grand Narratives. That isn’t to say we don’t face problems, many of which are open to partisan disagreement. But in general, the country seems to me to have become substantially post-partisan. To put it in a way that will drive a lot of you nuts: Canada, as a state, might have reached the End of History in the Fukuyamian sense.

Which means that the idea that the Liberals will come out of this conference brimming with a grand national vision is misplaced. Instead of a big policy conference every few decades, where they expect to set in motion a strategy that will bring them years of comfortable power, the Liberals might want to consider having a regular series of small conferences. Hold them every two years, or one a year alternating official languages. Or better yet, make long-term strategic thinking a permanent part of the party appparatus. But keep it small and keep it nimble — the world operates in a much higher tempo than it did when Mulroney was in power.

What the Liberals need are not a couple of Big Ideas (High Speed Rail! National Energy Grid!) that will require massive amounts of political and financial capital, but a whole bunch of great little ideas. Can a bunch of little ideas add up to a comprehensive strategy that could serve as a proper political brand? Of course. It’s harder to do, and it requires, in many ways, far more in the way of leadership.

Is Ignatieff the man for the job? Maybe, but only if he shows himself willing to think small.

(In many ways, what I’m getting at is something close to what Andrew Coyne and I both argued a few years ago for the 40th anniversay of This Magazine — our little essays are available here.)

are different challenges facing the country,

already feel the excitement building in the party, and with excitiemetn

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  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

    It seems like a really dumb place to park their hopes. When I think of the rise of the Harper Conservatives, or even the Obama phenomenon, both relied heavily on a relationship to the grassroots (whether symbolic or actual is another matter). This Big Thinkers scheme is rooted in top-down policy making (it feels Trudeauish, n'est pas?), and could further alienate the party from voters.

    I suspect the substance of policy is mattering less and less to Canadians, whereas they at least need to feel like they're a part of things.

    On a related note, I wonder if Manning still has those giant 'THINK BIG' letters kicking around in his garage?

    (p.s.: Andrew – you forgot to delete the last few scratch sentences.)

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

      "When I think of the rise of the Harper Conservatives, or even the Obama phenomenon, both relied heavily on a relationship to the grassroots (whether symbolic or actual is another matter)."

      Wrong on both front. The pre-Govt Harper laid out his Big Policy plans for his grassroots. Once in power, voters were asked to develop collective amnesia and forget everything he ever said on fiscal and social matters. Obama very much put forth Big Policy items, not to mention a clear vision for his country.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

        Obama's campaign certainly had big ideas, but was driven through the power of micro-donations and internet 'word of mouth'. I was careful to suggest that grassroots participation in policy need only be symbolic, and "Yes We Can" was designed to make individuals feel empowered.

        I think you're driven more by ideological projection than rational analysis when it comes to the Conservatives. Their base has continually ponied up donations, which is why they are so willing to surrender the per vote subsidy. Most of their party policies are very much the product of grassroots grievances. Failing to deliver on those platform planks can be debated as an outcome of minorities or outright cynicism on Harper's part, but it''s undeniable that the Conservatives have acheived their power through careful attention to the rank and file members of their party.

      • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

        Obama's campaign certainly had big ideas, but was driven through the power of micro-donations and internet 'word of mouth'. I was careful to suggest that grassroots participation in policy need only be symbolic, and "Yes We Can" was designed to make individuals feel empowered.

        I think you're driven more by ideological projection than rational analysis when it comes to the Conservatives. Their base has continually ponied up donations, which is why they are so willing to surrender the per vote subsidy. Most of their party policies are very much the product of grassroots grievances with traditional federal governance. Failing to deliver on those platform planks can be debated as an outcome of minorities or outright cynicism on Harper's part, but it''s undeniable that the Conservatives have acheived their power through careful attention to the rank and file members of their party.

        • kcm

          Sean i think you're missing something here. The Cons may have acchieved power by paying attention to rank and file members, but the result is not so different from liberal methods/style. The libs normally campaign from the left and govern from the centre – in other words they pay attention to their base too. But in both cases the parties run into something called reality once they're actually given power. As AP says ideally they abandon ideaology for pragmatism. Trudeau was the exception. Love him or leave him he did come with a set of ideas and an agenda. We can't, and probably shouldn't exspect that to happen too often. The liberal party needs to realise this and move on.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

          "I think you're driven more by ideological projection than rational analysis when it comes to the Conservatives. Their base has continually ponied up donations, which is why they are so willing to surrender the per vote subsidy. "

          Say Sean, why do you think that their base continually ponies up donations, as you say? I'd like to hear your "rational analysis" on that one, pls.

  • Camloops

    I'll believe it when I see it. Remember how their policy convention in the spring turned out? No policy.

    This will probably just turn out to be a campaign rhetoric brainstorming session. But I wait to be proven incorrect.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

    I bleive Mr Potter has rung a bell here. The problem isnt lack of Big Policy (a marketing/promotion problem. The problem is the big lack of policy (a product problem).

    As for it being top down or bottom up. It doesnt matter where the process starts but it has to iterate and percolate through all levels of the Liberal Party. Which is why I never understood the suicidal lurch towards an election, when they kept delaying this process.

    As well, just having the conference in January doesnt mean anything if they dont give it the time…I have said before and I will say it again the Liberal Party and Michael Ignatieff could each do themselves a favour and set their clocks to be prepare for an election in the Fall of 2010 or after. Any earlier and they are doign themselves and the Canadian people a disservice.

    But never underestimate a poltiical party's ability to get distracted by short term issues, that appplies to all of them.

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

    I believe Mr Potter has rung a bell here. The problem isnt lack of Big Policy (a marketing/promotion problem. The problem is the big lack of policy (a product problem).

    As for it being top down or bottom up. It doesnt matter where the process starts but it has to iterate and percolate through all levels of the Liberal Party. Which is why I never understood the suicidal lurch towards an election, when they kept delaying this process.

    As well, just having the conference in January doesnt mean anything if they dont give it the time…I have said before and I will say it again the Liberal Party and Michael Ignatieff could each do themselves a favour and set their clocks to be prepare for an election in the Fall of 2010 or after. Any earlier and they are doign themselves and the Canadian people a disservice.

    But never underestimate a poltiical party's ability to get distracted by short term issues, that appplies to all of them.

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/VinceClortho VinceClortho

    I believe Mr Potter has rung a bell here. The problem isnt lack of Big Policy (a marketing/promotion problem). The problem is the big lack of policy (a product problem).

    As for it being top down or bottom up. It doesnt matter where the process starts but it has to iterate and percolate through all levels of the Liberal Party. Which is why I never understood the suicidal lurch towards an election, when they kept delaying this process.

    As well, just having the conference in January doesnt mean anything if they dont give it the time…I have said before and I will say it again the Liberal Party and Michael Ignatieff could each do themselves a favour and set their clocks to be prepare for an election in the Fall of 2010 or after. Any earlier and they are doign themselves and the Canadian people a disservice.

    But never underestimate a poltiical party's ability to get distracted by short term issues, that appplies to all of them.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/psiclone psiclone

    Whenever I enounter both the words ' Liberal ' and ' Big ' in the same paragraph my first reaction is to grab my wallet and look furtively around for the inevitable invisible hand reaching for it.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

      I too prefer the Conservative approach which involves stealing our children's and grandchildren's money.

      • wilson

        The coalition approach, forced on the elected government…?

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

          Would you guys kindly revise your talking points? We don't elect governments.

          But yes, I forgot that nothing is the Conservatives' fault or responsibility. Ever.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

    "What the Liberals need are not a couple of Big Ideas (High Speed Rail! National Energy Grid!) that will require massive amounts of political and financial capital, but a whole bunch of great little ideas. Can a bunch of little ideas add up to a comprehensive strategy that could serve as a proper political brand? Of course. It’s harder to do, and it requires, in many ways, far more in the way of leadership."

    Sounds like Potter is arguing for Retail politics as opposed to putting forth "visionary" type of policies.

    I couldn't disagree more. Putting forth a clear vision with Big Ideas a la Green Shift is what requires true courage, conviction and leadership nowadays, I don't care what the pundits say.

    Retail politics is the easy way out.

    • Foreigner

      I think it's just Andrew Potter who doesn't like big ideas. Unless their his.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/avr avr

      Putting forth a clear vision with Big Ideas a la Green Shift

      Refresh my memory; how'd that work out for them?

    • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/avr avr

      Putting forth a clear vision with Big Ideas a la Green Shift

      Refresh my memory; how'd that work out for them?

      When your first priority is a Big Idea, it's very easy to overlook that it might also be a Bad Idea.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

        That it was a bad idea is matter of opinion, avr. The point I made remains. It takes guts, courage and leadership to present a vision and an articulate idea like that of the Green Shift to voters. When was the last time that a politician presented something with this kind of scope and thought?

        Ridiculous policies like -2% on the GST don't require leadership. They don't even require deep thinking. The sheer stupidity of that policy says a whole lot about the people who put it forward.

        • wilson

          Reducing the only tax low income Canadians pay, is a stupid idea?

          But raising taxes on everything, and then giving low income Canadians a break on the taxes you just raised,
          is a courageous idea?
          Right, the carrot and the stick.

  • Foreigner

    "To put it in a way that will drive a lot of you nuts: Canada, as a state, might have reached the End of History in the Fukuyamian sense."

    I don't understand. What's the point of attempting to make a persuasive argument by invoking a thesis that has been proved false, now just with the passage of time, but at the time it was advanced?

    Oh, hang on. "Persuasive argument?" From Andrew Potter?

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/robert_mccl6309 Robert McClelland

    What that means is that Canadian politics is much less amenable to Big Ideas and Grand Narratives.

    Really, then why did Harper attain power with Big Ideas (reforming the Senate) and Grand Narratives (Canada's back!)? What you should be saying is that Canadian politics is much less satisfied by Big Ideas and Grand Narratives alone and now requires concrete steps to implement those Big Ideas and Grand Narratives.

    • hosertohoosier

      He didn't win on those issues. If you recall, Harper lost in 2004 (when he still supported both of those things, in addition to major tax cuts). Moreover, his senate reform platform was incremental (if the provinces wanted to he would honour provincial senate elections and pick the winner of the senate election).

      Harper won on a platform that focused on a few small changes.
      1. A 2% GST cut.
      2. A baby bonus
      3. a wait time guarantee
      4. Some "tough on crime" legislation
      5. the accountability act
      6. More money for the provinces (this was emphasized more in Quebec)

      In 2008 he won with no platform.

      Incidentally, I disagree with Potter that the red book was a revolutionary document – it wasn't. It involved incremental changes (and maybe one major one – universal childcare – that was not met), and only looks revolutionary because it allowed the Liberals to stay in power for 13 years. You can do a lot if you stay in power for a long time. Even if you win an election as a radical, by contrast, as soon as you lose power, it is easy to reverse your reforms.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/JulesAime JulesAime

    "As always, Liberals are thinking back to the famous Kingston conference that energized the Pearson years, and the Aylmer conference that gave Chretien a push."

    These two contrasting conferences nicely illustrate the problem. I was at the Aylmer conference. It was a tightly scripted event designed to produce a series of outcomes predetermined by Chretien's inner circle. By all accounts, the Kingston conference was something else altogether. It's an open question whether the Liberals are willing and able to have a public discussion of actual ideas.

    And you don't have to look far for the reason. Are the Liberals the party of the left that their core supporters want them to be or are they the pragmatic centrists they want hoi polloi to believe they are. If they keep trying to be both, they will have to run scripted "ideas" like they had in Aylmer.

    • kcm

      Kingston seemed to have caught the zeitgeist. Can it happen again for the liberal party? I don't see much evidence of openness to new ideas, sadly. They could be a great party again. Maybe liberalism has run its course; it always seemed to need to have big windmills to tilt at. But now It seems to be a bean-counters world. Call me a pesimist but i don't like where politics seems to be headed in this country.

  • captcold

    Potter misses the mark, the target, heck – even the firing range itself with this one.

    "A political party is the hinge institution of a democracy, where policy gets transferred into power. It’s bad for democracy when a party is too ideological and unwilling to sacrifice principle for power"

    Parties ain't the 'hinge' – not for a generation. They are a collection of people who desire landing on the public teat. Those parties who sacrifice principle for power – ding! Same ghouls slobbering over your wallet.

    Shame to see a blogger/writer so jaded as to believe the interests of a political party are above those of the nation. There is good public policy, and bad public policy.

    Following bad public policy to retain power is likely the most contemptible action a public figure can pursue.

    So tell me Andrew – how does a journo get so pitifully jaded as to advocate such a world?

  • Blues Clair

    Yes, but, just because an idea fails politically, doesn't mean it's a bad idea.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Crit_Reasoning Crit_Reasoning

    Hooray! Big thoughts are a-comin'!

    • Dot

      You called?

  • Mike B

    "See: Liberal party from 2000 to 2006"

    See: Conservative party from 2006-present

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

    Try reading the piece again. Carefully. He's not advocating so much as analyzing.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/TwoYen TwoYen

    I think it may be a good idea for the Liberals to hold a policy conference. I would even welcome any good policy proposals that come out of it.

    But, if the Liberals are sincere in having a true policy conference and not just putting it on for show, then they need far more than three months to plan it. These things take at least six months to do properly. They can't be slapped together over the Xmas parliamentary break.

    I have the impression that this conference is more for show than a real attempt to identify the "next big policy thing". And that's too bad for the Liberals. Ignatieff should take a deep breath, accept the fact that his party will be in opposition for at least another year, and use the time to do something properly rather than rushing things in order to meet an artificial "election window" next spring.

    • hosertohoosier

      Actually I think fad-ism is a real problem for the Liberals. They keep trying to define themselves in response to events. Martin took this to extremes, running around the country saying "this is very important!" Dion did this too – his emphasis on the environment largely coincided with an unusually warm winter, and an uptick in environmental awareness. It didn't last however. Similarly, Ignatieff has been defining himself in light of the recession, running a resume campaign ("we can do better", not "we would do things differently") – and as the recession wanes, so too does Iggy's schtick. Heck even Harper fell prey to this kind of posturing in 2004 when he focused his entire campaign on the sponsorship scandal.

      Parties need bedrock values and ideas that they are willing to stick to, even in bad times, and yes, even if there are temporary electoral costs. Why? Because a party that loses its grassroots can't fundraise or organize. Moreover, it makes voting for that party something like pulling the lever on a slot machine. You can go too far (as the Republicans have), but I don't think the Liberals are anywhere close to doing so. The news changes rapidly, and short term gains from basing policy on the news eat up long-term gains from developing credibility in particular issue areas.

  • Foreigner

    A decent analysis is usually accompanied by some kind of evidence.

    He's not advocating nor analyzing. He's orating.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

    I likely haven't been clear enough, to be fair. Let me try again!

    Both the Conservatives and Obama were successful at tapping into reasonably focussed grassroots concerns and/or desires, and converting those into broader campaign platforms. I just don't see that happening in a single conference, which is likely to produce more top-down, Green Shift type proposals. Big Ideas, in this context, are something of a short cut to the hard work of creating and sustaining a political movement that resonates with large numbers of voters. And short cuts are usually dumb approaches, in my opinion.

    I have no quibble with the notion that all parties must face pragmatic realities once attaining power (sometimes we can even call that moderation or compromise – it isn't necessarily a bad thing in all cases).

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

    Why is this so hard for you?

    Because the party makes them feel like they have a voice. And substantively, many of their platform planks were the direct product of tapping into the real grievances and desires of their members. The Conservatives have been faced with minority parliaments, and thus have been cut a lot of slack by the base (it's another debate as to the wisdom of the Conservative base, in that respect).

    • Rich

      Quite right, one of the main problems with the Liberals at this time is the annointing of certain leaders by the party hierarchy: There are some in LPC that want to go to a one man one vote at their convention which allows the grass roots people to have a say in who represents them. The CPC did that at their convention.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

    "Big Ideas, in this context, are something of a short cut to the hard work of creating and sustaining a political movement that resonates with large numbers of voters. And short cuts are usually dumb approaches, in my opinion. "

    Without the big ideas and the vision, how do you propose to create a political movement? I'm sorry but what you are saying doesn't make sense to me.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

    *in the context of a short cut*

    There's nothing wrong at all with big ideas and vision. But the source of such things has to be rooted in what people want, to put it plainly. One can fairly accuse the 'right' of cynical populism, when this approach is taken to extremes, but the 'left' has a tendency to assume the brilliance of their ideas are self evident.

    Maybe that worked for Trudeau, to some extent. But the current Liberal party needs to first find out what resonates with voters, THEN look at translating that into larger policy. As Two Yen aptly argues further down, it just isn't possible to slam together a quickie conference and assume anyone will care about the results.

  • kcm

    I tend to agree with you. It doesn't really matter where the ideas come from. To say they're all top down driven isn't accurate or fair. Liberal pols have to listen to their constituents and party members too. The generation of ideas large or small is a much more difficult process to discribe or define than most of us realise. And really dumb top down ideas still have to be sold and hopefully rejected. That said the liberals have to spend more time connecting to their grass roots, something they've been arguably poor at.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

    You have it backwards, Sean. The Reformers presented their vision for the country and the people came. Not the other way around.

    That's what the Liberals are lacking. I would even say that what we have seen so far are small ideas (EI reform, protection for Canadians abroad, etc.) and no one is buying. Should Iggy come forth with a clear path for Canadians and one big idea, I think the reception will be different.

    The High Speed Rail is a great and worthy project but it is not a Big Idea. Sorry.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/jolyon jolyon

    "The type and formula of most schemes of philanthropy or humanitarianism is this: A and B put their heads together to decide what C shall be made to do for D. The radical vice of all these schemes, from a sociological point of view, is that C is not allowed a voice in the matter, and his position, character, and interests, as well as the ultimate effects on society through C's interests, are entirely overlooked. I call C the Forgotten Man. For once let us look him up and consider his case, for the characteristic of all social doctors is, that they fix their minds on some man or group of men whose case appeals to the sympathies and the imagination, and they plan remedies addressed to the particular trouble …. " William G Sumner, The Forgotten Man

    Whenever a left wing party proposes Big Ideas, I automatically think of Sumner's Forgotten Man.

    I think Libs problem is that they have won the ideological battle. Canadians are happy to live in a fascist state that takes care of them from cradle to grave, I even saw an ad last night from Ont government telling me how to store potatoes at home, so there are no big ideas left. Until the other parties, mainly the Cons, start to challenge status quo there are no debates to be had.

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/jolyon jolyon

    "The type and formula of most schemes of philanthropy or humanitarianism is this: A and B put their heads together to decide what C shall be made to do for D. The radical vice of all these schemes, from a sociological point of view, is that C is not allowed a voice in the matter, and his position, character, and interests, as well as the ultimate effects on society through C's interests, are entirely overlooked. I call C the Forgotten Man. For once let us look him up and consider his case, for the characteristic of all social doctors is, that they fix their minds on some man or group of men whose case appeals to the sympathies and the imagination, and they plan remedies addressed to the particular trouble …. " William G Sumner, The Forgotten Man

    Whenever a left wing party proposes Big Ideas, I automatically think of Sumner's Forgotten Man.

    I think Libs problem is that they have won the ideological battle. Canadians are happy to live in a fascist state that takes care of them from cradle to grave, I even saw an ad last night from Ont government telling me how to store potatoes at home, so there are no big ideas left. Until the other parties, mainly the Cons, start to challenge status quo there are no debates to be had.

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