Beyond The Commons

Beyond The Commons

Aaron Wherry covers all the goings-on in and around Parliament Hill. Follow Aaron on Twitter: @aaronwherry

'I have not seen those reports'

by Aaron Wherry on Thursday, October 15, 2009 11:47pm - 56 Comments

The Defence Minister tells Canadian Press he never saw Richard Colvin’s reports on the treatment of detainees in Afghan prisons. CP points out that he was equally unaware of a Foreign Affairs annual report on human reports that also flagged torture.

MacKay, who was foreign minister at the time, insisted Thursday that he knew nothing of the documents. ”I have not seen those reports in either my capacity as minister of National Defence or previously as minister of Foreign Affairs,” he said in a telephone interview from Halifax. ”I can’t speak for other ministers.”

Richard Colvin, who is now an intelligence officer at the Canadian embassy in Washington, wrote in May 2006 that the allegations of torture regarding Afghan prisoners were “serious, imminent and alarming.” He followed it up with another warning in early June 2006, almost a full year before the federal government acknowledged the problem. Colvin said he spoke with prisoners who claimed to have been tortured by their jailers and that inmates showed physical signs of abuse.

… The Foreign Affairs Department produces annual reports on human rights in individual developing countries and the 2006 review on Afghanistan specific flagged that country’s prison system as rife with torture. The following year as MacKay was questioned about it in the House of Commons he denied having read that document as well, despite it having been widely circulated in his own department.

Gordon O’Connor tells Global he too was unaware of Colvin’s reports.

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  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jenn_ Jenn_

    Wow, how incredibly convenient. Wouldn't it be nice if we could all live our lives that way? Just don't bother doing your job, and nothing is your fault!

    But I did love O'Connor's reply. It is always some staffers fault, isn't it, but this time with a twist. It was the staffer's fault unless the other staffer (Richard Colvin) was found "not to be credible". I do wonder what it takes to be important enough to bother the Minister with it.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

      It's hard to believe they actually ran on a platform of accountability. I've rarely seen a group so adverse to taking ownership of their actions and inactions.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SisyphusThis SisyphusThis

    Oh, it's just a bent cog in the smoothly running gears of open government ….

    http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/ar…

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/danby danby

      It keeps getting better and better

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jenn_ Jenn_

      You've always got the best links, Sisyphus. Thanks, I learn more from you than my local paper.

  • Dave

    Giorno's teaching them the Norm Sterling defense already?

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/doug_rogers doug_rogers

    MacKay must have got the job because of his good looks and great hair.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/OntarioTown OntarioTown

      Good looks and great hair? A matter of taste I guess. He got because of daddy and Harper owes him for lying (seems to be a habit) in bringing the right and right-right together.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/TwoYen TwoYen

      Wherry's already said Gerrard Kennedy has great hair. Do we now have to have a contest? My vote is for Paul Shaffer.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/ChrisInKW ChrisInKW

        I miss Pierre Pettigrew in this regard.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/robert_mccl6309 Robert McClelland

    Canada's Conservative Government: We know nothink!

    We should put together a list of all the times they've claimed they didn't know what was going on.

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/robert_mccl6309 Robert McClelland

    Canada's Conservative Government: We know nothing!

    We should put together a list of all the times they've claimed they didn't know what was going on.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

      Typical union inefficiency. Make a list of the times they DID know, and you'll get the job done five times faster.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/robert_mccl6309 Robert McClelland

        To be fair though, there is the possibility that MacKay actually didn't see the documents because they were left at Julie Couillard's house.

    • MJ Patchouli

      I agree — Radwanski keeps bleating for a "narrative" — well isn't this it? Their incessant unaccountability of the government on all issues that are important to us.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/PhilCP PhilCP

        Issues that are important to you, but it seems not so important to many others.

  • Anon

    It's not that hard to believe that Peter MacKay can't read.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Stewart_Smith Stewart_Smith

      It is possible this is part of his long term strategy to get into the Senate.

      • Lord Kitchener's Own

        Groan.

        (and a little LOL).

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/OntarioTown OntarioTown

    MacKay has become Canada's Colonel Klink – I know nothing.

    Now I expect the media to try to dumb this down – got to protect Harper after all.

    • MJ Patchouli

      It was Sgt Schultz who knew nothing. But I like the comparison — Shulz and Manuel from Fawlty Towers.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/OntarioTown OntarioTown

        Whoops – you're right. Rob Nicholson is Colonel Klink.

        • MJ Patchouli

          Exactly! Right down to the thin, pursed, disapproving lips.

  • tobyornottoby

    If they didn't see the reports that alone is a scandal because while credible organizations were raising concerns about prisoners, this government was giving assurances that no one was being mistreated.

    What were those assurances based on if they didn't read the reports submitted by the people who were assigned to investigate?

    Either a lie or unbelievable incompetence.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jenn_ Jenn_

      Exactly. Closing your eyes, putting your hands over your ears and singing "la-la-la-la" is not my idea of Responsible Government.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/DroppingBY DroppingBY

    I fear that most Canadians, and Canadian media, really don't care much about this whole thing.

    Most people seem to think that sending detainees off to be tortured is just a "technical" violation of the high international standards that we claim to support in principle, but don't feel the need to adhere to in practice, especially when dealing with "enemies" we have been conditioned through propaganda (as usual) to view as evil, subhuman, etc.

    If it was the Taliban sending our troops off to be tortured, then we'd care a lot, of course, and we'd express our "principled" humanitarian opposition to this behaviour.

    In the present circumstances, however, the Harperites know that they can pretty well openly lie and dissemble on this, and even if they get totally outed by a few reporters, there will be no political price to pay for this.

    Sad, really, but I think we are, once again, getting the government we deserve.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/doug_rogers doug_rogers
  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

    Heh.

  • leroy

    This is what happens when the party in power spends more time on politics than governing, which seems to be what many Canadians support according to polls.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Geiseric Geiseric

      They think it's a reality show.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/danby danby

        I think most of the voters think politics is a reality show. However, they only vote if they can do so online or on the phone.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Stewart_Smith Stewart_Smith

    for those too young or forgetful

    [youtube 34ag4nkSh7Q http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34ag4nkSh7Q youtube]

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/M_A_N M_A_N

    To be fair, he likely didn't see the actual reports. Much more likley, one of his aides prepared a one-page summary of the reports, and briefed him on the contents.

    The sheer volume of paper in a government ministry almost precludes a minister from reading everything. That's why he has staff who bring importnat stuff to his attention. And if his staff didn't think this was important, there should be a parking lot full of buses waiting for said staff to be thrown under the wheels.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jenn_ Jenn_

      And apparently Colvin sent it via several different paths, so there would have been more than one staffer who thought it of no importance. I can't see it, myself.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/OntarioTown OntarioTown

      Yup, blame everyone else. Now that's taking responsibility for you

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/danby danby

    Harry Truman: The buck stops here

    Peter MacKay: I have not seen those reports

    Stephen Harper: When I become prime minister I will undertake an unprecedented overhaul of the federal government. Cleaning up government begins at the top. I will replace the culture of entitlement with a culture of accountability.

    Danby: Pffffft

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/danby danby

    Harry Truman: The buck stops here

    Peter MacKay: I have not seen those reports

    Stephen Harper: When I become prime minister I will undertake an unprecedented overhaul of the federal government. Cleaning up government begins at the top. I will replace the culture of entitlement with a culture of accountability.

    Danby: Pffffft

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/danby danby

    Harry Truman: The buck stops here

    Stephen Harper: When I become prime minister I will undertake an unprecedented overhaul of the federal government. Cleaning up government begins at the top. I will replace the culture of entitlement with a culture of accountability.

    Peter MacKay: I have not seen those reports

    Danby: Well. That tclears that up

  • http://www.intensedebate.com/people/danby danby

    Harry Truman: The buck stops here

    Stephen Harper: When I become prime minister I will undertake an unprecedented overhaul of the federal government. Cleaning up government begins at the top. I will replace the culture of entitlement with a culture of accountability.

    Peter MacKay: I have not seen those reports

    Danby: Well. That clears that up

  • William

    I don`t know guys, Afghanistan is one ugly place to be and I wish we were not there and I think that there is a lot of ugly things happening there that I don`t even want to know about. But it`s war and the enemy has chosen to fight by digging holes in the road, placing bombs, and wait for someone to get blown to pieces. And if the Afghan police used some nasty methods to find out some info that saved some innocent Afghans or maybe my neighbor`s kid, then so be it.

    But if it makes you feel better to tee off on a gov`t minister caught between his role as a cabinet minister and his desire not to take actions that harm the Canadian troops, then fill your boots. You should feel very smug and righteous sitting in your warm basement defending all that you interpret as right and wrong—-and please feel free to blast me for having understood that the war in Afghanistan is not a Philosophy and Ethics class at U of T.

  • http://kathleenw@execulink.com Mark

    He is the same as Elmer who was in the DARK about Karlheinz Schrieber his best friend was doing with Lying Brian.

  • E.B.

    If Peter's feelings are the same as yours then perhaps he should have said he read the reports but didn't give a rat's ass about what happened to the prisoners that were turned over.

    If these reports weren't important enough to reach his eyes, then I have to wonder just what is important enough.

    I guess ignorance is bliss, and gives you plausible deniablity to any abuse that is uncovered 'down the road'.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/TwoYen TwoYen

    Yes, Pierre Pettigrew had great hair. Pettigrew was a dead ringer for ex-Japanese Prime Minister and Elvis fan, Junichiro Koizumi, who recently became the voice of Japanese anime superhero Ultraman. Perhaps Pettigrew can find a similar post-political career?.

  • William

    Oh, I would love it if politicans would speak their mind but I would also be naive and you know that.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jenn_ Jenn_

    It is good of you to be honest, William, I'll give you that. For myself, if I have a principle that I feel is worthy, I will stick by that principle even when it is inconvenient to do so. Sort of what makes it a principle, instead of a whim.

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