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	<title>Comments on: For it before he was against it, Easter edition</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/</link>
	<description>Canada&#039;s only national weekly current affairs magazine.</description>
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		<title>By: ActionJackson</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203110</link>
		<dc:creator>ActionJackson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 02:26:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203110</guid>
		<description>&quot;Total gun killings are down.&quot;

This matters because people killed with non-guns are less dead?  The total homicide rate hasn&#039;t significantly changed (it&#039;s been between 2.2 and 1.8 since 1993).

&quot;Long gun killings, as a proportion of those deaths are down substantially.&quot;

Again, why does this matter.  If you start registering long guns, criminals find it is just as easy to get an illegal handgun.  The public safety benefits of gun control were realized with user licensing (safety training and backgrounds checks).  These registry schemes are just bureaucratic make-work projects so politicians have something to point to and say: &quot;See!  We&#039;re dealing with gang violence!&quot;

Unfortunately, dealing with actual criminals is harder than hassling hunters and target shooters.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&quot;Total gun killings are down.&quot;</p>
<p>This matters because people killed with non-guns are less dead?  The total homicide rate hasn&#039;t significantly changed (it&#039;s been between 2.2 and 1.8 since 1993).</p>
<p>&quot;Long gun killings, as a proportion of those deaths are down substantially.&quot;</p>
<p>Again, why does this matter.  If you start registering long guns, criminals find it is just as easy to get an illegal handgun.  The public safety benefits of gun control were realized with user licensing (safety training and backgrounds checks).  These registry schemes are just bureaucratic make-work projects so politicians have something to point to and say: &quot;See!  We&#039;re dealing with gang violence!&quot;</p>
<p>Unfortunately, dealing with actual criminals is harder than hassling hunters and target shooters.</p>
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		<title>By: richard</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203109</link>
		<dc:creator>richard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 14:31:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203109</guid>
		<description>With the Conservatives&#039; imposition of mandatory minimums, they&#039;ll be making criminals out of hard working farmers. Shame.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With the Conservatives&#039; imposition of mandatory minimums, they&#039;ll be making criminals out of hard working farmers. Shame.</p>
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		<title>By: burlivespipe</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203108</link>
		<dc:creator>burlivespipe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 08:21:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203108</guid>
		<description>Wilson, are you suggesting we should register farmers? Perhaps that&#039;s going to be part of the CONs next fundraising letter, now that this is (temporarily at least) off the table.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wilson, are you suggesting we should register farmers? Perhaps that&#039;s going to be part of the CONs next fundraising letter, now that this is (temporarily at least) off the table.</p>
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		<title>By: SisyphusThis</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203107</link>
		<dc:creator>SisyphusThis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 03:44:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203107</guid>
		<description>Well, Liberals have always been tough on crime, eh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, Liberals have always been tough on crime, eh.</p>
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		<title>By: Jenn_</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203106</link>
		<dc:creator>Jenn_</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:23:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203106</guid>
		<description>How many of them SERVED the days in jail?  I&#039;m just curious.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How many of them SERVED the days in jail?  I&#039;m just curious.</p>
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		<title>By: wilson</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203104</link>
		<dc:creator>wilson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:03:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203104</guid>
		<description>Bill Moore, 63, from Red Deer, faced 131 days in jail. He donated a bag of wheat to a 4-H Club, then took a half-ton truck of wheat across the border.

Jim Ness, 58, from New Brigden, faced 25 days in jail. He drove 100 lbs. of barley across the border and donated it to the 4-H Club.

Mark Peterson, 42, from Cereal, faced 124 days in jail. He hauled a truckload of wheat across the border.

Rick Strankman, 49, from Altario, faces 180 days in jail. He took 756 bushels of wheat across the border and sold it for $1.50 per bushel higher than the Canadian price.

John Turcato, 42, from Taber, faced 131 days in jail. He drove 900 bushels of barley across the border.

Darren Winczura, 35, from Viking, faced 24 days in jail. He drove a bag of wheat across the border.

Thankyou Ralph Goodale.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bill Moore, 63, from Red Deer, faced 131 days in jail. He donated a bag of wheat to a 4-H Club, then took a half-ton truck of wheat across the border.</p>
<p>Jim Ness, 58, from New Brigden, faced 25 days in jail. He drove 100 lbs. of barley across the border and donated it to the 4-H Club.</p>
<p>Mark Peterson, 42, from Cereal, faced 124 days in jail. He hauled a truckload of wheat across the border.</p>
<p>Rick Strankman, 49, from Altario, faces 180 days in jail. He took 756 bushels of wheat across the border and sold it for $1.50 per bushel higher than the Canadian price.</p>
<p>John Turcato, 42, from Taber, faced 131 days in jail. He drove 900 bushels of barley across the border.</p>
<p>Darren Winczura, 35, from Viking, faced 24 days in jail. He drove a bag of wheat across the border.</p>
<p>Thankyou Ralph Goodale.</p>
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		<title>By: wilson</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203105</link>
		<dc:creator>wilson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:03:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203105</guid>
		<description>Martin Hall, 42, from Vulcan, faced 131 days in jail. He took a semi-trailer full of wheat across the border and sold it.

Rod Hanger, 32, from Three Hills, faced 75 days in jail. He took a commercial load of wheat across the border and sold it.

Noel Hyslip, 42, from Vulcan, faced 131 days in jail. He took a semi-trailer full of wheat across the border and sold it.

Ike Lanier, 72, from Lethbridge, faced 60 days in jail. He trucked 300 bushels across the border.

...more jailed farmers:</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Martin Hall, 42, from Vulcan, faced 131 days in jail. He took a semi-trailer full of wheat across the border and sold it.</p>
<p>Rod Hanger, 32, from Three Hills, faced 75 days in jail. He took a commercial load of wheat across the border and sold it.</p>
<p>Noel Hyslip, 42, from Vulcan, faced 131 days in jail. He took a semi-trailer full of wheat across the border and sold it.</p>
<p>Ike Lanier, 72, from Lethbridge, faced 60 days in jail. He trucked 300 bushels across the border.</p>
<p>&#8230;more jailed farmers:</p>
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		<title>By: wilson</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203103</link>
		<dc:creator>wilson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:02:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203103</guid>
		<description>Wayne Easter is a woozy.
 When Ralph Goodale had the chance,
he threw  Western Canadian grain farmers in the clink!

Here is a list of the farmers and their penalties.

Gary Brandt, 33, of Viking, faced 62 days in jail. He took a bag of wheat across the border, forgot about it and ended up carrying it back into Canada.

Ron Duffy, 50, from Lacombe, faced 68 days in jail. He took one bag across the border, then a commercial quantity of wheat across the line.

Jim Chatenay, 59, from Penhold, faced 62 days in jail. He took a bushel of wheat to the U.S. and donated it to a 4-H club.

continued</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wayne Easter is a woozy.<br />
 When Ralph Goodale had the chance,<br />
he threw  Western Canadian grain farmers in the clink!</p>
<p>Here is a list of the farmers and their penalties.</p>
<p>Gary Brandt, 33, of Viking, faced 62 days in jail. He took a bag of wheat across the border, forgot about it and ended up carrying it back into Canada.</p>
<p>Ron Duffy, 50, from Lacombe, faced 68 days in jail. He took one bag across the border, then a commercial quantity of wheat across the line.</p>
<p>Jim Chatenay, 59, from Penhold, faced 62 days in jail. He took a bushel of wheat to the U.S. and donated it to a 4-H club.</p>
<p>continued</p>
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		<title>By: KOL</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203102</link>
		<dc:creator>KOL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:32:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203102</guid>
		<description>Easter was a minister.  Ministers must observe cabinet solidarity and should refrain from expressing their personal views, especially concerning government policy, in public.  For all we know, Easter was against the registry at the time and argued for its reform/abolition in cabinet meetings but lost that battle and accepted the outcome.  I am sure examples of hypocrisy by MPs of all parties on this question abound but this is not one of them.  Mr. Easter was a backbencher when the bill was first passed in 1995.  It would be of greater interest to know what his opinions on the matter were at that time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Easter was a minister.  Ministers must observe cabinet solidarity and should refrain from expressing their personal views, especially concerning government policy, in public.  For all we know, Easter was against the registry at the time and argued for its reform/abolition in cabinet meetings but lost that battle and accepted the outcome.  I am sure examples of hypocrisy by MPs of all parties on this question abound but this is not one of them.  Mr. Easter was a backbencher when the bill was first passed in 1995.  It would be of greater interest to know what his opinions on the matter were at that time.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203101</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:34:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203101</guid>
		<description>Umm, direct quote, from the above article: &quot;For a second consecutive year, gang-related homicides dropped substantially&quot;
The whole purpose of bringing empirical data into a discussion is so that we can do away with premises like &quot;probably has increased significantly&quot;.
Furthermore, I don&#039;t expect us to agree on ideology, but surely we can accept the basic rules of algebra as a starting premise for any meaningful discussion.
Total gun killings are down. Long gun killings, as a proportion of those deaths are down substantially. That means, by even Jim Flaherty&#039;s math, long gun killings have been reduced significantly in the tiome period since the registry came in.
I readily concede that that, in and of itself does not prove the effectiveness of the registry. But since the neocons are going to drag statitics into the debate, tell me what possible statistic or quantifiable measurement could the otherisde bring into the discussion, if the one I have mentioned above can be cited by an Alberta justice minister as proof - &lt;i&gt;to the contrary?&lt;i/&gt;
&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Umm, direct quote, from the above article: &quot;For a second consecutive year, gang-related homicides dropped substantially&quot;<br />
The whole purpose of bringing empirical data into a discussion is so that we can do away with premises like &quot;probably has increased significantly&quot;.<br />
Furthermore, I don&#039;t expect us to agree on ideology, but surely we can accept the basic rules of algebra as a starting premise for any meaningful discussion.<br />
Total gun killings are down. Long gun killings, as a proportion of those deaths are down substantially. That means, by even Jim Flaherty&#039;s math, long gun killings have been reduced significantly in the tiome period since the registry came in.<br />
I readily concede that that, in and of itself does not prove the effectiveness of the registry. But since the neocons are going to drag statitics into the debate, tell me what possible statistic or quantifiable measurement could the otherisde bring into the discussion, if the one I have mentioned above can be cited by an Alberta justice minister as proof &#8211; <i>to the contrary?&lt;i/&gt;<br />
</i></p>
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		<title>By: Nich</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203100</link>
		<dc:creator>Nich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:24:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203100</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s more complicated than that. The smuggling of handguns alone from the US has probably increased significantly from that time, as has gang activity (outside of bikers) and related murders.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#039;s more complicated than that. The smuggling of handguns alone from the US has probably increased significantly from that time, as has gang activity (outside of bikers) and related murders.</p>
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		<title>By: Wascally Wabbit</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203099</link>
		<dc:creator>Wascally Wabbit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:17:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203099</guid>
		<description>Time for Iggy to clean house IN THE HOUSE. He could do well to start with Wayne Easter, continue with Keith Martin and a few others - put the fear of God into the rest of the caucus that the party has some core values. Replace the two of them with people who can command a broader respect - because right now - I place Messrs. Easter &amp; Martin in the same bag of cynics that include Carol Hughes on the NDP team.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Time for Iggy to clean house IN THE HOUSE. He could do well to start with Wayne Easter, continue with Keith Martin and a few others &#8211; put the fear of God into the rest of the caucus that the party has some core values. Replace the two of them with people who can command a broader respect &#8211; because right now &#8211; I place Messrs. Easter &amp; Martin in the same bag of cynics that include Carol Hughes on the NDP team.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203098</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:07:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203098</guid>
		<description>&quot;Of the 149 gun killings last year, handguns accounted for two-thirds, up from about one-half during the 1990s and one-third prior to 1990.&quot;

In other words, guns other than handguns accounted for 2/3 of gun killings before the 1990s, guns other than handguns accounted for 1/2 of gun killings during the 1990s and guns other than handguns accounted for 1/3 killings thereafter.

Guns other than handguns = &quot;long guns&quot;

Since the total number of gun killings decreased over that period, the number of gun killings caused by &quot;long guns&quot; decreased quite significantly from the time the registry was implemented.

But hey, there&#039;s no empirical evidence to suggest the long gun registry was of any use. It has &quot;shown no effectiveness&quot;.

In light of the above, what possible statistic could gun control advocates possibly use to make the case for registering long guns?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&quot;Of the 149 gun killings last year, handguns accounted for two-thirds, up from about one-half during the 1990s and one-third prior to 1990.&quot;</p>
<p>In other words, guns other than handguns accounted for 2/3 of gun killings before the 1990s, guns other than handguns accounted for 1/2 of gun killings during the 1990s and guns other than handguns accounted for 1/3 killings thereafter.</p>
<p>Guns other than handguns = &quot;long guns&quot;</p>
<p>Since the total number of gun killings decreased over that period, the number of gun killings caused by &quot;long guns&quot; decreased quite significantly from the time the registry was implemented.</p>
<p>But hey, there&#039;s no empirical evidence to suggest the long gun registry was of any use. It has &quot;shown no effectiveness&quot;.</p>
<p>In light of the above, what possible statistic could gun control advocates possibly use to make the case for registering long guns?</p>
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		<title>By: psiclone</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/11/06/for-it-before-he-was-against-it-easter-edition/comment-page-1/#comment-203097</link>
		<dc:creator>psiclone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 20:00:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=91046#comment-203097</guid>
		<description>Excellent research I had no idea - only in canadian politics from hypocrisy to doorknobs - go figure!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent research I had no idea &#8211; only in canadian politics from hypocrisy to doorknobs &#8211; go figure!</p>
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