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	<title>Comments on: Is Canada shirking its international obligations when it comes to climate change?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/</link>
	<description>Canada&#039;s only national weekly current affairs magazine.</description>
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		<title>By: Nicolas Vigneau</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220453</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicolas Vigneau</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 19:03:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220453</guid>
		<description>Anyone who votes that climate change is a myth is an embarassment to humankind.
How can anyone be so blind? Or scared to lose their comfortable indecent lives...
Yes it s a big show that can be criticized, but Groenland has shrunk by half, no matter
how much lies and fake solutions are being thrown in our faces...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anyone who votes that climate change is a myth is an embarassment to humankind.<br />
How can anyone be so blind? Or scared to lose their comfortable indecent lives&#8230;<br />
Yes it s a big show that can be criticized, but Groenland has shrunk by half, no matter<br />
how much lies and fake solutions are being thrown in our faces&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Thwim</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220451</link>
		<dc:creator>Thwim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 20:24:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220451</guid>
		<description>How is it a distraction given that we know the rest of the world wants to live in the style that Canadians do, if not better?

How is it a distraction when there are other countries, like Sweden, that aren&#039;t nearly as high on a per-capita basis?

We&#039;re in a place where we have the opportunity, and the ability, to figure out how to do a lot more with a lot less.. and if we get off the stick and figure out how to do it first, it&#039;s a huge opportunity to sell that technology to the developing world and our more eco-minded neighbours.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How is it a distraction given that we know the rest of the world wants to live in the style that Canadians do, if not better?</p>
<p>How is it a distraction when there are other countries, like Sweden, that aren&#039;t nearly as high on a per-capita basis?</p>
<p>We&#039;re in a place where we have the opportunity, and the ability, to figure out how to do a lot more with a lot less.. and if we get off the stick and figure out how to do it first, it&#039;s a huge opportunity to sell that technology to the developing world and our more eco-minded neighbours.</p>
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		<title>By: Thwim</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220452</link>
		<dc:creator>Thwim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 20:21:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220452</guid>
		<description>And why do we use more than swedes?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And why do we use more than swedes?</p>
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		<title>By: Thwim</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220450</link>
		<dc:creator>Thwim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 20:20:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220450</guid>
		<description>Water is life-giving as well. Go stick your face in a pail of it for half-an-hour, please, would you?

And no, it hasn&#039;t been cooling. The temperature data was provided to statisticians without telling them what the data represented, they all agreed there was no discernable trend of decreasing numbers whatsoever. See here: &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/10/26/tech/main5423035.shtml&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/10/26/tech/ma...&lt;/a&gt;

Sunspot activity has been on a lull for a long time now. Temperatures keep climbing.

Ice is not denser than water, but you&#039;re correct in that it doesn&#039;t increase the level of the water, if it&#039;s in the water already. Unfortunately, in Antarctica, the ice is on a large land mass, and melting into the water.

Really all just basic facts, which if you&#039;d engaged in looking up the actual science rather than anti-climate change blog posts, you&#039;d see.

As for your other arguments, whether you&#039;ve raised them yet or not, they&#039;re debunked here:
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Water is life-giving as well. Go stick your face in a pail of it for half-an-hour, please, would you?</p>
<p>And no, it hasn&#039;t been cooling. The temperature data was provided to statisticians without telling them what the data represented, they all agreed there was no discernable trend of decreasing numbers whatsoever. See here: <a href="http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/10/26/tech/main5423035.shtml" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/10/26/tech/ma&#8230;</a></p>
<p>Sunspot activity has been on a lull for a long time now. Temperatures keep climbing.</p>
<p>Ice is not denser than water, but you&#039;re correct in that it doesn&#039;t increase the level of the water, if it&#039;s in the water already. Unfortunately, in Antarctica, the ice is on a large land mass, and melting into the water.</p>
<p>Really all just basic facts, which if you&#039;d engaged in looking up the actual science rather than anti-climate change blog posts, you&#039;d see.</p>
<p>As for your other arguments, whether you&#039;ve raised them yet or not, they&#039;re debunked here:<br />
<a href="http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php</a></p>
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		<title>By: brian</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220449</link>
		<dc:creator>brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 17:26:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220449</guid>
		<description>dont read macleans.ca it is complete trash</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dont read macleans.ca it is complete trash</p>
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		<title>By: PeterH</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-220448</link>
		<dc:creator>PeterH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 17:19:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220448</guid>
		<description>who cares what the Europeans think of Canada - what do we think of them? bunch of morons.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>who cares what the Europeans think of Canada &#8211; what do we think of them? bunch of morons.</p>
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		<title>By: PeterH</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-2/#comment-220447</link>
		<dc:creator>PeterH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 17:08:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220447</guid>
		<description>Climate is always changing, but now the doomsday people are trying to make a profit out of this. It is all about money and who is making money out of all this political nonsense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Climate is always changing, but now the doomsday people are trying to make a profit out of this. It is all about money and who is making money out of all this political nonsense.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeremy</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220446</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeremy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Dec 2009 06:01:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220446</guid>
		<description>I suppose this is not going to matter to those who have already decided anthropogenic climate change is a hoax, farce, or even conspiracy, but here is Scientific American&#039;s take on it. And this is not some &quot;lefty&quot; publication.
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=scientists-respond-to-climategate-controversy&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=...&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suppose this is not going to matter to those who have already decided anthropogenic climate change is a hoax, farce, or even conspiracy, but here is Scientific American&#039;s take on it. And this is not some &quot;lefty&quot; publication.<br />
<a href="http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=scientists-respond-to-climategate-controversy" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=&#8230;</a></p>
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		<title>By: Cornell</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-220445</link>
		<dc:creator>Cornell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 15:53:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220445</guid>
		<description>Thank you, TomK. You&#039;ve crammed a lot of insight into a few sentences .
  I&#039;m posting that in the staff room.  I particularly like the phrase &quot;true north strong and freezing&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, TomK. You&#039;ve crammed a lot of insight into a few sentences .<br />
  I&#039;m posting that in the staff room.  I particularly like the phrase &quot;true north strong and freezing&quot;.</p>
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		<title>By: Martin</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-2/#comment-220444</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 14:29:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220444</guid>
		<description>By the way selfish, look at the geomorphology of Hudson Bay, and realize that when the seas will rise by 2050, Churchill, Manitoba will be a souvenir... Nothing more nothing less : a bunch of climate refugees on our own soil and millions of dollars will be spent to move the port south or west... or leave it there and make a New Orleans out of it (could have also said Amsterdam)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way selfish, look at the geomorphology of Hudson Bay, and realize that when the seas will rise by 2050, Churchill, Manitoba will be a souvenir&#8230; Nothing more nothing less : a bunch of climate refugees on our own soil and millions of dollars will be spent to move the port south or west&#8230; or leave it there and make a New Orleans out of it (could have also said Amsterdam)</p>
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		<title>By: Georges Kanout&#233;</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-4/#comment-220443</link>
		<dc:creator>Georges Kanout&#233;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 03:00:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220443</guid>
		<description>he&#039;s fine. enjoying his retirement, writing newspaper columns and the like, i think.
now that that&#039;s out of the way, can you please explain to me why what i said is wrong and how the carbon market, as it currently exists, will reduce GHG emissions?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>he&#039;s fine. enjoying his retirement, writing newspaper columns and the like, i think.<br />
now that that&#039;s out of the way, can you please explain to me why what i said is wrong and how the carbon market, as it currently exists, will reduce GHG emissions?</p>
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		<title>By: don hrehirchek</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220442</link>
		<dc:creator>don hrehirchek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 20:06:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220442</guid>
		<description>Climate change is a natural phenomenom, Hope I spelled it right. Climate change happens year round. Too bad we can not choose  a natural cause.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Climate change is a natural phenomenom, Hope I spelled it right. Climate change happens year round. Too bad we can not choose  a natural cause.</p>
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		<title>By: Ebby</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220441</link>
		<dc:creator>Ebby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 04:23:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220441</guid>
		<description>I think this poll and the large %  of its responses it got can be summed up in one word.  POINTLESS.  I have other words I&#039;d like to use.   I don&#039;t want to seem like a hypocrite here as I did find myself reading through the conversations here, because honestly I find this form of debauchery amusing, but don&#039;t you people have something better to be doing with your time? Time to go bake some bread, sort my recycling and have some wild sex with the man.... Enjoy your weekend all.  Wait my post was pointless too!! Yaaaaargh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think this poll and the large %  of its responses it got can be summed up in one word.  POINTLESS.  I have other words I&#039;d like to use.   I don&#039;t want to seem like a hypocrite here as I did find myself reading through the conversations here, because honestly I find this form of debauchery amusing, but don&#039;t you people have something better to be doing with your time? Time to go bake some bread, sort my recycling and have some wild sex with the man&#8230;. Enjoy your weekend all.  Wait my post was pointless too!! Yaaaaargh.</p>
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		<title>By: Ebby</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-2/#comment-220440</link>
		<dc:creator>Ebby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 04:12:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220440</guid>
		<description>Second person to comment using the word medieval and didnt know how to spell it...  curious.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Second person to comment using the word medieval and didnt know how to spell it&#8230;  curious.</p>
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		<title>By: factfreak</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220439</link>
		<dc:creator>factfreak</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 20:18:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220439</guid>
		<description>Ice is much denser than water, you say? Is that why ice floats on water? You have shot your silly arguments in the head.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ice is much denser than water, you say? Is that why ice floats on water? You have shot your silly arguments in the head.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeremy</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220438</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeremy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 19:01:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220438</guid>
		<description>With 2% of world GHG emissions even a 100% reduction is meaningless in global terms. Dwelling on per capita #&#039;s (where our 33Mil population is amoung highest) is a distraction metric favoured by the GW fanatics.  Need to focus on the global problem.  Therefore, a made in Canada solution oblivious to programs major emitters develop would be the wrong plan.  Must coordinate our program(s) with the majors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With 2% of world GHG emissions even a 100% reduction is meaningless in global terms. Dwelling on per capita #&#039;s (where our 33Mil population is amoung highest) is a distraction metric favoured by the GW fanatics.  Need to focus on the global problem.  Therefore, a made in Canada solution oblivious to programs major emitters develop would be the wrong plan.  Must coordinate our program(s) with the majors.</p>
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		<title>By: Fiona McMurran</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-1/#comment-220437</link>
		<dc:creator>Fiona McMurran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 16:38:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220437</guid>
		<description>Right on, DivisionBell. And Norway wasn&#039;t dumb enough to be bound by Chapter 11 of NAFTA. It isn&#039;t required to supply the US with oil whether or not it has any reserves for itself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right on, DivisionBell. And Norway wasn&#039;t dumb enough to be bound by Chapter 11 of NAFTA. It isn&#039;t required to supply the US with oil whether or not it has any reserves for itself.</p>
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		<title>By: fiona McMurran</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-2/#comment-220436</link>
		<dc:creator>fiona McMurran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 16:36:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220436</guid>
		<description>Uh-huh. Take a look at the stats on climate refugees around the world NOW. And then imagine it getting far, far worse. Cimate wars, that&#039;s what we&#039;re going to see, and if you think Canada is going to be immune, you are dreaming in technicolour.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Uh-huh. Take a look at the stats on climate refugees around the world NOW. And then imagine it getting far, far worse. Cimate wars, that&#039;s what we&#039;re going to see, and if you think Canada is going to be immune, you are dreaming in technicolour.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony .Toronto</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220435</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony .Toronto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 16:25:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220435</guid>
		<description>Q. Why do Canadians use 6 times more  enegy than    Mexicans,Algerians or Indians?.,

A. See &quot;World Map&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Q. Why do Canadians use 6 times more  enegy than    Mexicans,Algerians or Indians?.,</p>
<p>A. See &quot;World Map&quot;</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220429</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 14:23:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220429</guid>
		<description>Sorry to burst your bubble, but some of the emails were as recent as two months ago.
And of course if you have access to the base records, and can delete and modify at will, (and somehow they claim they can&#039;t find them now) how reliable do you you think this data really is?
When you start with a false assumption, or false data sets, all get is false data out. Garbage in, garbage out in programming language.
Lastly it IS CONVENIENT and I find it wonderful, not odd. How do you know it wasn&#039;t a conscientious whistle blower out there that and didn&#039;t have any agenda or funding? If it was a hislte Blower it certainly isn&#039;t illegal. The Blinders I am afraid are being borne by you. Making accusations about funding of hackers. A wild claim swinging in the dark.
Why don&#039;t we wait to see if the Arctic melts first? There&#039;s too many people on the earth anyway according to the &quot;Warmists&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry to burst your bubble, but some of the emails were as recent as two months ago.<br />
And of course if you have access to the base records, and can delete and modify at will, (and somehow they claim they can&#39;t find them now) how reliable do you you think this data really is?<br />
When you start with a false assumption, or false data sets, all get is false data out. Garbage in, garbage out in programming language.<br />
Lastly it IS CONVENIENT and I find it wonderful, not odd. How do you know it wasn&#39;t a conscientious whistle blower out there that and didn&#39;t have any agenda or funding? If it was a hislte Blower it certainly isn&#39;t illegal. The Blinders I am afraid are being borne by you. Making accusations about funding of hackers. A wild claim swinging in the dark.<br />
Why don&#39;t we wait to see if the Arctic melts first? There&#39;s too many people on the earth anyway according to the &quot;Warmists&quot;.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-2/#comment-220416</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 12:47:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220416</guid>
		<description>OMG! Now you&#039;re trying to lump the Greens in on the right side of the political Spectrum like the Lefties like to do with the NAZI&#039;s (National Socialists)?
Come on Georges.
You are correct about them not being Environmentalists (first). It is merely their vehicle to meet the end (Socialism, or at least the end of Capitalism).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OMG! Now you&#39;re trying to lump the Greens in on the right side of the political Spectrum like the Lefties like to do with the NAZI&#39;s (National Socialists)?<br />
Come on Georges.<br />
You are correct about them not being Environmentalists (first). It is merely their vehicle to meet the end (Socialism, or at least the end of Capitalism).</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220434</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 09:45:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220434</guid>
		<description>Awesome response!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Awesome response!</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220433</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 09:41:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220433</guid>
		<description>Again obfuscating the subject. Pollution is pollution. CO2 is LIFE GIVING!
Nice to see the elders in the north being part of that &quot;SCIENTIFIC&quot; community. I wonder where they got their degrees?
WHat if- just what if the models were wrong as they apparently are based on fudged data, and the world really has been cooling for ten years now (which it has been), and the previous warming was brought on by high sunspot activity, which is a fact, and you have now ripped apart your country and given its resources away to the third world which continues to overbreed and is not held to account for their contributions.

Giving away your house so homeless people can have one is non-sensical. It makes you homeless too.
Besides, the ice (which is much denser than water) displaces no more mass than the medium itself. Try melting 6 ice cubes in a glass of water, and see if it overflows. then get back to me with your &quot;proof&quot; on how the polar ice caps melting is going to cause the water levels to rise some 30 feet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Again obfuscating the subject. Pollution is pollution. CO2 is LIFE GIVING!<br />
Nice to see the elders in the north being part of that &quot;SCIENTIFIC&quot; community. I wonder where they got their degrees?<br />
WHat if- just what if the models were wrong as they apparently are based on fudged data, and the world really has been cooling for ten years now (which it has been), and the previous warming was brought on by high sunspot activity, which is a fact, and you have now ripped apart your country and given its resources away to the third world which continues to overbreed and is not held to account for their contributions.</p>
<p>Giving away your house so homeless people can have one is non-sensical. It makes you homeless too.<br />
Besides, the ice (which is much denser than water) displaces no more mass than the medium itself. Try melting 6 ice cubes in a glass of water, and see if it overflows. then get back to me with your &quot;proof&quot; on how the polar ice caps melting is going to cause the water levels to rise some 30 feet.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-4/#comment-220432</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 09:30:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220432</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d say his first paragraph shows his ignorance. Just because I can&#039;t swallow some faked science means I am equivalent to a NAZI?
Come on now. Give your side a chance before you shoot yourself in the face.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#039;d say his first paragraph shows his ignorance. Just because I can&#039;t swallow some faked science means I am equivalent to a NAZI?<br />
Come on now. Give your side a chance before you shoot yourself in the face.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-4/#comment-220431</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 09:26:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220431</guid>
		<description>Hey Che. How&#039;s Fidel?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Che. How&#039;s Fidel?</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220430</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 09:25:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220430</guid>
		<description>I am sure the &quot;A&quot; voters have noticed and taken exuberant clicks of the mouse. It has been admitted to that some have come here just to vote for the &quot;A&quot; side.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am sure the &quot;A&quot; voters have noticed and taken exuberant clicks of the mouse. It has been admitted to that some have come here just to vote for the &quot;A&quot; side.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220428</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 09:14:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220428</guid>
		<description>You have replied numerous times. What are your &quot;Vested Interests&quot;, Amber?
Remember dear Amber, it is not for those of us to prove AGW exists. It is up to the claimers to prove it. We don&#039;t have to deny anything other than there is something that stinks to high heaven in this whole mess. Open the nostrils and take a sniff. Maybe, just maybe the other side actually does have a point about not being convinced when not only the data has been tampered with, but the whole concept of AGW falls beyond credulity due to so many common sense principles, such as:
In Science, there is no such thing as &quot;Consensus&quot;. It is either what the publishers say it is or it is not. The data (uncooked of course) must be published in a proper scientific journal and be PEER REVIEWED. This means that all data and conditions must be DUPLICATED and VERIFIED INDEPENDENTLY. It is then either yeah or nay, not some &quot;Consensus&quot;. Science is a world of absolutes when trying to make a point.
Cooking the data and hiding the real facts when you are the official keeper of the raw data from which all reviews are based on means that the science is far from &quot;settled&quot;.
Why should we read your suggested propaganda? having some anxiety that maybe people are catching on to your game?
And how about taking in some good viewing &quot;The Great Global Warming Swindle&quot; from the BBC? Not on your approved list in the AGW Church, so I doubt you will.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You have replied numerous times. What are your &quot;Vested Interests&quot;, Amber?<br />
Remember dear Amber, it is not for those of us to prove AGW exists. It is up to the claimers to prove it. We don&#039;t have to deny anything other than there is something that stinks to high heaven in this whole mess. Open the nostrils and take a sniff. Maybe, just maybe the other side actually does have a point about not being convinced when not only the data has been tampered with, but the whole concept of AGW falls beyond credulity due to so many common sense principles, such as:<br />
In Science, there is no such thing as &quot;Consensus&quot;. It is either what the publishers say it is or it is not. The data (uncooked of course) must be published in a proper scientific journal and be PEER REVIEWED. This means that all data and conditions must be DUPLICATED and VERIFIED INDEPENDENTLY. It is then either yeah or nay, not some &quot;Consensus&quot;. Science is a world of absolutes when trying to make a point.<br />
Cooking the data and hiding the real facts when you are the official keeper of the raw data from which all reviews are based on means that the science is far from &quot;settled&quot;.<br />
Why should we read your suggested propaganda? having some anxiety that maybe people are catching on to your game?<br />
And how about taking in some good viewing &quot;The Great Global Warming Swindle&quot; from the BBC? Not on your approved list in the AGW Church, so I doubt you will.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-4/#comment-220427</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 09:00:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220427</guid>
		<description>Big Science always gets a pass when trotting out the &quot;funders&quot;.
These Scientists have a dog in this race as surely as Big Oil does. Big Oil can handle it -they have deep pockets (about to be cleaned out by the Commies), but these scientists have signed on to something that is not peer reviewed, meaning it has no way of being independently verified and duplicated because the baseline figures have been tampered with. They will lose their professional reputations, and their livelihoods (if the funding from GOVERNMENT AND GREEN INDUSTRY dries up). So it is in their interest to stick to it.
Socialists have a dog in it too. They get to over govern and over regulate and over tax- their wet dream.
Before jumping out and claiming the &quot;other side is posting hoax science&quot;, I think you better take a hard look at your side first.
I respect Dr. Timothy Ball as an actual Climate Scientist. He asked a few questions and was shunned from the community as an Apostate. Now would real scientists that were objective do that to a vetted and respected member of that scientific community if they didn&#039;t have an agenda?
Come on Common Sense, you seem to be lacking a bit of your namesake.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Big Science always gets a pass when trotting out the &quot;funders&quot;.<br />
These Scientists have a dog in this race as surely as Big Oil does. Big Oil can handle it -they have deep pockets (about to be cleaned out by the Commies), but these scientists have signed on to something that is not peer reviewed, meaning it has no way of being independently verified and duplicated because the baseline figures have been tampered with. They will lose their professional reputations, and their livelihoods (if the funding from GOVERNMENT AND GREEN INDUSTRY dries up). So it is in their interest to stick to it.<br />
Socialists have a dog in it too. They get to over govern and over regulate and over tax- their wet dream.<br />
Before jumping out and claiming the &quot;other side is posting hoax science&quot;, I think you better take a hard look at your side first.<br />
I respect Dr. Timothy Ball as an actual Climate Scientist. He asked a few questions and was shunned from the community as an Apostate. Now would real scientists that were objective do that to a vetted and respected member of that scientific community if they didn&#039;t have an agenda?<br />
Come on Common Sense, you seem to be lacking a bit of your namesake.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220426</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 08:51:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220426</guid>
		<description>Don&#039;t worry about your insurance premiums going up. If the &quot;Warmists&quot; get their way, you&#039;ll be paying thousands if not tens of thousands more per person for everything you do including heating up your TOFU and Granola.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don&#039;t worry about your insurance premiums going up. If the &quot;Warmists&quot; get their way, you&#039;ll be paying thousands if not tens of thousands more per person for everything you do including heating up your TOFU and Granola.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220425</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 08:49:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220425</guid>
		<description>Respected as in CLIMATEGATE? Persecute real peer review, cook the books and temperatures? Skew the results?
Yes, indeed &quot;respected&quot;. If that&#039;s your idea of respect then I don&#039;t think your opinion matters much to people of &quot;Common Sense&quot;.

Al Gore admitted he lied, but claimed it was for the &quot;greater good&quot;. Liars, Cheats and Thieves. Swindlers all these &quot;warmists&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Respected as in CLIMATEGATE? Persecute real peer review, cook the books and temperatures? Skew the results?<br />
Yes, indeed &quot;respected&quot;. If that&#039;s your idea of respect then I don&#039;t think your opinion matters much to people of &quot;Common Sense&quot;.</p>
<p>Al Gore admitted he lied, but claimed it was for the &quot;greater good&quot;. Liars, Cheats and Thieves. Swindlers all these &quot;warmists&quot;.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220424</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 08:29:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220424</guid>
		<description>Yes, Donna by &quot;we&quot; you mean &quot;YOU&quot;. Let&#039;s have a vote on it, shall we?
how about we put the Copenhagen accord up like the Charlatan Accord, and see if the public goes for it. But of course you wouldn&#039;t be so in favour of this accord if it meant $1000 more per year on your Electrical bill, another $1500 per year for the heat, another $1500 per year for Gasoline/Diesel, and of course you&#039;ll have to buck up a few more thousand to pay for the Govt bureaucrats to oversee the extra 15 departments of CO2 control that will need to be set up.
The Left always thinks that somebody else will pay the price (and they will get gov&#039;t subsidies for their part), but we all pay the price for foolishness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, Donna by &quot;we&quot; you mean &quot;YOU&quot;. Let&#039;s have a vote on it, shall we?<br />
how about we put the Copenhagen accord up like the Charlatan Accord, and see if the public goes for it. But of course you wouldn&#039;t be so in favour of this accord if it meant $1000 more per year on your Electrical bill, another $1500 per year for the heat, another $1500 per year for Gasoline/Diesel, and of course you&#039;ll have to buck up a few more thousand to pay for the Govt bureaucrats to oversee the extra 15 departments of CO2 control that will need to be set up.<br />
The Left always thinks that somebody else will pay the price (and they will get gov&#039;t subsidies for their part), but we all pay the price for foolishness.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220423</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 08:21:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220423</guid>
		<description>&quot;The facts, data, and evidence do, and all of that points to global warming being real, and man-made CO2 being the most significant driver of that warming trend.&quot;

What? The FACT that thousands of emails leaked showed quite handily how easily those &quot;facts, data, and evidence&quot; was &quot;cleaned, destroyed, and propagandized&quot; shows that you are too loyal to your religion and have thus ceased to function as a reasonable arbiter with common sense.

It is very reasonable to question everything, especially that which smells to high heaven. But the Leftists and Warmers will have none of this Blasphemy!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&quot;The facts, data, and evidence do, and all of that points to global warming being real, and man-made CO2 being the most significant driver of that warming trend.&quot;</p>
<p>What? The FACT that thousands of emails leaked showed quite handily how easily those &quot;facts, data, and evidence&quot; was &quot;cleaned, destroyed, and propagandized&quot; shows that you are too loyal to your religion and have thus ceased to function as a reasonable arbiter with common sense.</p>
<p>It is very reasonable to question everything, especially that which smells to high heaven. But the Leftists and Warmers will have none of this Blasphemy!</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220422</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 08:14:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220422</guid>
		<description>Church Doctrine. Have you read anything that is not on the Al Gore Approved Reading List?
I thought not.

How about some sort of offset for the fact that we live in a country that needs to heat the abode for 9 months of the friggin year!
it is much easier and much more humane for Mexico to cut back on their use of CO2 than it is for us freezing in the cold. There must be a provision for geographical requirements.
Otherwise this whole argument is a complete non-starter with me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Church Doctrine. Have you read anything that is not on the Al Gore Approved Reading List?<br />
I thought not.</p>
<p>How about some sort of offset for the fact that we live in a country that needs to heat the abode for 9 months of the friggin year!<br />
it is much easier and much more humane for Mexico to cut back on their use of CO2 than it is for us freezing in the cold. There must be a provision for geographical requirements.<br />
Otherwise this whole argument is a complete non-starter with me.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220421</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 08:03:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220421</guid>
		<description>I see. So the &quot;Warmist&quot; Socialist side has been spammed to their Lefty sites to come here and freep the poll to as to skew the results. I see.
The left always likes to fight fair.

Honourable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I see. So the &quot;Warmist&quot; Socialist side has been spammed to their Lefty sites to come here and freep the poll to as to skew the results. I see.<br />
The left always likes to fight fair.</p>
<p>Honourable.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220420</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 08:00:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220420</guid>
		<description>Interesting only when it eschewed your Leftist point of view eh Blais?
Nothing but contempt and condescension for dissenting opinion is an idiosyncrasy of the left.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting only when it eschewed your Leftist point of view eh Blais?<br />
Nothing but contempt and condescension for dissenting opinion is an idiosyncrasy of the left.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-2/#comment-220419</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 07:56:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220419</guid>
		<description>Well Nicole as our population in Canada is quite small and we have a large land mass, I think we are safe. Maybe you should take your problem of overpopulation into the Muslim, Hindu communities of the world, where they have a real problem with Birth Control. Quebec is on the demographic death Spiral, most of the West  is, Japan, Russia, China has curbed its out of control problem for the time being. But look at some of the worst &quot;hot spots&quot; in the world, and you&#039;ll find over population is a problem there. NOT HERE!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well Nicole as our population in Canada is quite small and we have a large land mass, I think we are safe. Maybe you should take your problem of overpopulation into the Muslim, Hindu communities of the world, where they have a real problem with Birth Control. Quebec is on the demographic death Spiral, most of the West  is, Japan, Russia, China has curbed its out of control problem for the time being. But look at some of the worst &quot;hot spots&quot; in the world, and you&#039;ll find over population is a problem there. NOT HERE!</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-2/#comment-220418</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 07:50:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220418</guid>
		<description>Bravo!


Perfectly succinct the REAL TRUTH behind the Global Warming...ooops, Climate Change Hoax.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bravo!</p>
<p>Perfectly succinct the REAL TRUTH behind the Global Warming&#8230;ooops, Climate Change Hoax.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-2/#comment-220417</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 07:47:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220417</guid>
		<description>OMG! Now you&#039;re trying to lump the Greens in on the right side of the political Spectrum like the Lefties like to do with the NAZI&#039;s (National Socialists)?
Come on Georges.
You are correct about them not being Environmentalists (first). It is merely their vehicle to meet the end (Socialism, or at least the end of Capitalism).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OMG! Now you&#039;re trying to lump the Greens in on the right side of the political Spectrum like the Lefties like to do with the NAZI&#039;s (National Socialists)?<br />
Come on Georges.<br />
You are correct about them not being Environmentalists (first). It is merely their vehicle to meet the end (Socialism, or at least the end of Capitalism).</p>
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		<title>By: Anti-Ummah</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-2/#comment-220415</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti-Ummah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 07:38:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220415</guid>
		<description>Gee Derek, 3mm eh? I suppose you obtained those stats from East Anglia as well?
I understand that the Icebergs have been melting and thawing for millennia, long before EXXON.
What happened to the mini-ice age, and the Medaevil warm period in that Hockey stick scenario? Gonzo. Deleted.

It will be difficult for these &quot;scientists&quot; that did not do proper peer reviews of this work and signed on to it in BLIND FAITH ( also for personal financial gain and more govt grant money), and have their reputations to lose to become an AGW Apostate. However when the religion is flawed, you have to take the high road, and run - not walk away -  from the Charlatans that created this mess.
REPENT!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gee Derek, 3mm eh? I suppose you obtained those stats from East Anglia as well?<br />
I understand that the Icebergs have been melting and thawing for millennia, long before EXXON.<br />
What happened to the mini-ice age, and the Medaevil warm period in that Hockey stick scenario? Gonzo. Deleted.</p>
<p>It will be difficult for these &quot;scientists&quot; that did not do proper peer reviews of this work and signed on to it in BLIND FAITH ( also for personal financial gain and more govt grant money), and have their reputations to lose to become an AGW Apostate. However when the religion is flawed, you have to take the high road, and run &#8211; not walk away &#8211;  from the Charlatans that created this mess.<br />
REPENT!</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220414</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 05:42:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220414</guid>
		<description>Will have the same results as those that thought Bush was an angel.

Another 7 years on no activity and we will be that much closer to the truth.

By then it will be too late to make any significant change,   or those that say it is all a bunch of &quot;&quot;&quot;&quot;&quot; are right.   I hope they are right but personally think they are fools leading us down that path of no return and we will all suffer the consequences.. God, do I ever hope they are right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will have the same results as those that thought Bush was an angel.</p>
<p>Another 7 years on no activity and we will be that much closer to the truth.</p>
<p>By then it will be too late to make any significant change,   or those that say it is all a bunch of &quot;&quot;&quot;&quot;&quot; are right.   I hope they are right but personally think they are fools leading us down that path of no return and we will all suffer the consequences.. God, do I ever hope they are right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!</p>
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		<title>By: old fogey</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-3/#comment-220408</link>
		<dc:creator>old fogey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 04:48:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220408</guid>
		<description>I lived during the melting that occurred  during the ice age-thankfully we had Jack Layton  who stepped in and had a bill passed to prevent flooding .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I lived during the melting that occurred  during the ice age-thankfully we had Jack Layton  who stepped in and had a bill passed to prevent flooding .</p>
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		<title>By: ElectroPig™ Von FökkenGrüüven</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220413</link>
		<dc:creator>ElectroPig™ Von FökkenGrüüven</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 03:00:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220413</guid>
		<description>First thing that got me suspicious of &quot;global warming&quot; was the fact that too many governments around the world agreed.  That many governments NEVER agree on ANYTHING unless it&#039;s a prelude to restriction of their people, and taking more money from them.

Second thing that made me suspicious was the fact that less than 2 months went by and a global carbon credits SCAM was introduced.  GLOBAL leglsiative packages are NOT born in two months.  NEVER.  It&#039;s simply not possible to do anything like that in such a limited time frame.

Third thing that got me thinking was the fact that polluters get to buy carbon credits from non-polluters, allowing the non-polluters to continie not polluting, and allowing the polluters to keep polluting, resulting in a net benefit of ZERO enviromentally, but in the trillions globally in the form of new taxes and price hikes that ultimately are born by consumers.  The ONLY way to avoid this new &quot;non-tax&quot; is to stop consuming ANYTHING...and since that is not possible, the end result is that since everyone pays it, it is a form of taxation without representation...as are almost all forms of taxation today.

Talk about &quot;cow fart taxes&quot; brought the whole idea to the point of utter insanity.

While I am not anywhere near to being against green technologies, and I&#039;ve been tyring to convince people to put up solar panels for decades already--and been either completely ignored or ridiculed--if we do such things as plant a few solar panels on our roofs, this WILL decrease the requirement for carbon-burning/releasing fuels to heat our homes or generate electricity, and if it proves that the many and obvious falsities being put forward have any basis in truth, the these carbon emission reductions will already be in place, at a long-term benefit to the environment, and to the consumer&#039;s bank balance.

The main trouble is that our governments see the only way to fix anything is to find new ways to steal money from the people, and we&#039;re so accustomed to KNOWING that they&#039;re lying to us that we also KNOW that they can not be trusted to do anything BUT lie to us to steal more of our money.

The government KNOWS that the people are too stupid to run their own lives, and they seek to control ever more facets of our daily existence...but eventually, all the new government jobs are going to come crashing down when the time comes that there are more people working within government than are left to support it...it&#039;s time to look at reality for a change, and stop buying into all of the propaganda from those very same people that we already know have been lying to us for decades.

It&#039;s time to get rid of the genocidal criminals who have allowed this world to become what it is...only after they&#039;re gone will we be able to repair the damage that out of control governments have wrought against society.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First thing that got me suspicious of &#8220;global warming&#8221; was the fact that too many governments around the world agreed.  That many governments NEVER agree on ANYTHING unless it&#8217;s a prelude to restriction of their people, and taking more money from them.</p>
<p>Second thing that made me suspicious was the fact that less than 2 months went by and a global carbon credits SCAM was introduced.  GLOBAL leglsiative packages are NOT born in two months.  NEVER.  It&#8217;s simply not possible to do anything like that in such a limited time frame.</p>
<p>Third thing that got me thinking was the fact that polluters get to buy carbon credits from non-polluters, allowing the non-polluters to continie not polluting, and allowing the polluters to keep polluting, resulting in a net benefit of ZERO enviromentally, but in the trillions globally in the form of new taxes and price hikes that ultimately are born by consumers.  The ONLY way to avoid this new &#8220;non-tax&#8221; is to stop consuming ANYTHING&#8230;and since that is not possible, the end result is that since everyone pays it, it is a form of taxation without representation&#8230;as are almost all forms of taxation today.</p>
<p>Talk about &#8220;cow fart taxes&#8221; brought the whole idea to the point of utter insanity.</p>
<p>While I am not anywhere near to being against green technologies, and I&#8217;ve been tyring to convince people to put up solar panels for decades already&#8211;and been either completely ignored or ridiculed&#8211;if we do such things as plant a few solar panels on our roofs, this WILL decrease the requirement for carbon-burning/releasing fuels to heat our homes or generate electricity, and if it proves that the many and obvious falsities being put forward have any basis in truth, the these carbon emission reductions will already be in place, at a long-term benefit to the environment, and to the consumer&#8217;s bank balance.</p>
<p>The main trouble is that our governments see the only way to fix anything is to find new ways to steal money from the people, and we&#8217;re so accustomed to KNOWING that they&#8217;re lying to us that we also KNOW that they can not be trusted to do anything BUT lie to us to steal more of our money.</p>
<p>The government KNOWS that the people are too stupid to run their own lives, and they seek to control ever more facets of our daily existence&#8230;but eventually, all the new government jobs are going to come crashing down when the time comes that there are more people working within government than are left to support it&#8230;it&#8217;s time to look at reality for a change, and stop buying into all of the propaganda from those very same people that we already know have been lying to us for decades.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s time to get rid of the genocidal criminals who have allowed this world to become what it is&#8230;only after they&#8217;re gone will we be able to repair the damage that out of control governments have wrought against society.</p>
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		<title>By: jon</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220412</link>
		<dc:creator>jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 02:10:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220412</guid>
		<description>Climate change began when the earth began and has been changing ever since and as long as the earth exists climate will be changing and there not much earthlings can do about it unless they can learn how to control the sun. So there is not much use spending thrillions of dollars for not much climate change.
 20,000 years ago one third of the earth was covered in ice and the oceans were 400 feet lower than they are today and some time in the past they were about  60 feet higher than they are today. Global warming, well that started about 20,000 years ago when the glaciers  began to melt  and I dont think there was too many SUVs running around nor were there any coal burning power plants spewing carbon dioxide into the air. So Gore and Suziki tell me why did all that ice melt and the oceans rise 400 hundred feet?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Climate change began when the earth began and has been changing ever since and as long as the earth exists climate will be changing and there not much earthlings can do about it unless they can learn how to control the sun. So there is not much use spending thrillions of dollars for not much climate change.<br />
 20,000 years ago one third of the earth was covered in ice and the oceans were 400 feet lower than they are today and some time in the past they were about  60 feet higher than they are today. Global warming, well that started about 20,000 years ago when the glaciers  began to melt  and I dont think there was too many SUVs running around nor were there any coal burning power plants spewing carbon dioxide into the air. So Gore and Suziki tell me why did all that ice melt and the oceans rise 400 hundred feet?</p>
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		<title>By: canada</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220411</link>
		<dc:creator>canada</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 01:51:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220411</guid>
		<description>Brilliant:

I don&#039;t understand the position of those who want to do nothing to address climate change... just in case there is a giant conspiracy amongst the scientific community.

Here&#039;s how I see it:

Column 1 - AGW is real
Column 2 - AGW isn&#039;t real
Row 1 - Do something
Row 2 - Do nothing

C1R1 - Despite perhaps being too late, we make an effort to prevent massive disaster. Economic stimulus helps &#039;green&#039; growth while potentially harming fossil fuel industry. Crisis may not be averted but valiant efforts unite the nation and the world.
C1R2 - Worst case scenario. No effort is made and the results of AGW create misery, war, famine, climate refugees, and eco-terrorists who have a real bone to pick with Canada and USA.
C2R1- AGW isn&#039;t real but effort is made anyway. Green industry receives stimulus at taxpayers expense, thus leveling the field with the massive subsidies given to fossil fuel industry. Fossil fuel industry is no longer sucking up all the taxpayer subsidies and has real competition for the first time.
C2R2 - Status quo: we continue to subsidize fossil fuel industry at the expense of free market until green technologies are finally able to overcome the gov&#039;t coddling of fossil fuel industry and wind/solar/geothermal displaces fossil fuels with undeniable cost-savings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brilliant:</p>
<p>I don&#039;t understand the position of those who want to do nothing to address climate change&#8230; just in case there is a giant conspiracy amongst the scientific community.</p>
<p>Here&#039;s how I see it:</p>
<p>Column 1 &#8211; AGW is real<br />
Column 2 &#8211; AGW isn&#039;t real<br />
Row 1 &#8211; Do something<br />
Row 2 &#8211; Do nothing</p>
<p>C1R1 &#8211; Despite perhaps being too late, we make an effort to prevent massive disaster. Economic stimulus helps &#039;green&#039; growth while potentially harming fossil fuel industry. Crisis may not be averted but valiant efforts unite the nation and the world.<br />
C1R2 &#8211; Worst case scenario. No effort is made and the results of AGW create misery, war, famine, climate refugees, and eco-terrorists who have a real bone to pick with Canada and USA.<br />
C2R1- AGW isn&#039;t real but effort is made anyway. Green industry receives stimulus at taxpayers expense, thus leveling the field with the massive subsidies given to fossil fuel industry. Fossil fuel industry is no longer sucking up all the taxpayer subsidies and has real competition for the first time.<br />
C2R2 &#8211; Status quo: we continue to subsidize fossil fuel industry at the expense of free market until green technologies are finally able to overcome the gov&#039;t coddling of fossil fuel industry and wind/solar/geothermal displaces fossil fuels with undeniable cost-savings.</p>
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		<title>By: jon</title>
		<link>http://www2.macleans.ca/2009/12/07/is-canada-shirking-its-international-obligations-when-it-comes-to-climate-change/comment-page-5/#comment-220410</link>
		<dc:creator>jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 01:39:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www2.macleans.ca/?p=96528#comment-220410</guid>
		<description>Want to learn something, Google &quot;Sea Level and Climate&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Want to learn something, Google &quot;Sea Level and Climate&quot;</p>
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