Beyond The Commons

 Beyond The Commons

Aaron Wherry covers all the goings-on in and around Parliament Hill. Follow Aaron on Twitter: @aaronwherry

Categories: Beyond The Commons, Capital Read

Democracy reinstated

by Aaron Wherry on Friday, January 8, 2010 12:41am - 42 Comments

Conservative Brent Rathgeber issues an important clarification as to his previous statement on the state of democracy in Canada.

must clarify—Parliament is being suspended–democracy is much larger and much broader and of course continues everyday in Canada.

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  • Anon

    Was this a PMO-approved clarification?

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Thwim Thwim

      Doubtful. I expect it was a PMO-directed clarification.

  • Justin

    Sounds like someone got a phone call from the PMO.

  • Cam

    Dimitri must have screamed and hollered about that one! Speaking of Dimitri, he must really be feeling the heat, since his communications plan of sneaking out the Prorogue effort over Christmas has really backfired.

  • Anon

    Hello?… Uh… Hello D- uh hello Dmitri? Listen uh uh I can't hear too well. Do you suppose you could turn the music down just a little?… Oh-ho, that's much better… yeah… huh… yes… Fine, I can hear you now, Dmitri… Clear and plain and coming through fine… I'm coming through fine, too, eh?… Good, then… well, then, as you say, we're both coming through fine… Good… Well, it's good that you're fine and… and I'm fine… I agree with you, it's great to be fine… a-ha-ha-ha-ha… Now then, Dmitri, you know how we've always talked about the possibility of something going wrong with the prorogation…

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Scott_Tribe Scott_Tribe

    Well that's a relief, I can now sleep better.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Halo_Override Halo_Override

    The Facebook page just hit 100K, so I guess somebody's voting for something.

    • Dakota

      How many Facebook accounts do you have and how many times have you joined?

  • Dave

    Or more than six calls from constituents in Edmonton–St. Albert.

  • Dave

    Is there another kind?

  • Will

    Pure gold.

  • burlivespipe

    Geez, once Harper gets that majority he'll just suspend facebook…

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Jack_Mitchell Jack Mitchell

    "Did I say 'a sh*tload of grapeshot'? Really? On tape? Well, obviously I meant a whiff of grapeshot. Whiff, with an H, right. We're defending the Republic here. Whiff of grapeshot."

  • Tappen

    i think you mean he'll prorogue it

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/danby danby

    Rathgeber's clarification is soaked in his own urine

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

    And they wonder why Harper doesn't permit his MPs to speak…

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Ricard_S_Argent Richard_S_Argent

    and at 8:10 am the award for Funniest Thing I'll Read Online Today has already been won!

  • Anon

    So, Brent R., what is Parliament? I mean, people elect you to be a Member of Parliament.

    Time for a refresher course in civics for Brent baby, and his PMO handlers.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

    Oh please! That idiot is probably blaming Steven Guilbeault for it all.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Ricard_S_Argent Richard_S_Argent

    I find it fairly amusing how a majority of people in that EKOS poll find Harper's proroguation "undemocratic". Of course it's not really undemocratic, but then again, neither was a coalition.

    Harper appears to be getting punished by the very same kind of visceral reactions he so skillfully manipulated last year.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Ricard_S_Argent Richard_S_Argent

    Yeah, I think that has something to do with it. I also think that for many people, nuance doesn't really play well.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Nich Nich

    But sobriety does, which many Canadians seem to have made a resolution this year!

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

    The difference might be unimportant, but I think the poll used the word "anti-democratic". Not that I'm certain it would make any difference to most respondents.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Ricard_S_Argent Richard_S_Argent

    Yeah, I noticed that almost immediately after I posted and thought about editing my post, but like you came to the conclusion that for respondents the difference would be negligible.

    (to be clear though, the actions can most certainly be described as anti-democratic, but not undemocratic…would you agree?)

    p.s. The phrase I was casting about for but couldn't come up with was "hoisted on his own petard" :)

  • common man

    There`s way too many plus numbers on this Lib blog today so here is a little balance.

    All of you are hoping that there will be a massive revolt in the country because you are under the illusion that the public will all of a sudden feel nostalgic about Parliament. Well I`ve got news for you, when we think of Parliament we think of Question Period and to a lesser extent Committees. Coyne can tell us how these institutions have become poisoned but what we see are the same questions asked day after day after day and always the same answers. We know the only sincere motive the opp. has is to somehow use any method to embarass, injure, defeat the government.

    And you expect there will be people on the streets wanting to hurry and bring back that sheet. No you guys spend too much time theorizing and juvenile remarks. When you look back in a couple of months you will see that Harper was right once again.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/sea_n_mountains sea_n_mountains

    can't recall for sure Sean, but think you are right. i think it makes a difference because while prorogation is technically not "undemocratic", it infringes on the operation of the basic aspect of our democratic system.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/SeanStok SeanStok

    I like your original phrasing better, anyway.

    I only mentioned the word because it seemed unusual to me when I first read the piece. I wonder if the Ekos staff had a discussion about the meaning of "undemocratic" and decided that "anti" was somehow more accurate.

    I agree that the distinction is pragmatically meaningless between the two. But I do think it's possible to describe perfectly legal actions as un/antidemocratic. Common examples could include leaders forcing nominations upon ridings, back-room horsetrading deals between parties, whipping votes, stonewalling during QP, and so on: none of it is particularly illegal or against the constitution, but they are all arguably working against democracy in some way.

    I think most Canadians accept that "pure" democracy would be often too messy to get things done effectively, but at the same time have a vague sense of when politicians go too far, and at that point rally the term "undemocratic". Like now.

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