Beyond The Commons

Aaron Wherry covers all the goings-on in and around Parliament Hill. Follow Aaron on Twitter: @aaronwherry

Categories: Beyond The Commons, Capital Read

Never mind the deadline

by Aaron Wherry on Monday, May 31, 2010 4:53pm - 18 Comments

Today’s negotiations on the release of Afghan detainee documents ended with reported progress, but no resolution. As such, all parties have apparently agreed to extend the discussions for a few more days.

Tags: Afghanistan, detainees, documents, parliamentary privilege, privilege, transfers

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http://intensedebate.com/people/LynnTO LynnTO

In other words, democracy isn't dead, it's just comatose. smh.
http://intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

There never was a deadline. By parliamentary rules, the deadline was to be IMMEDIATE. So, Aaron, that train left the station ages ago when the Speaker made up his 14-day please-guys-don't-make-me-do-this plea.

http://intensedebate.com/people/Be_rad Be_rad

There has always been a political calculation available on the part of the opposition to accept the proposal the speaker made or to insist on going ahead. I wouldn't blame the Speaker for suggesting a political compromise that, from all appearances, the opposition were quite prepared to accept.

Wallace Cleaver

Running out the clock until the recess?

Andrew (not P or C)

That's my bet. If the oppo lets them do it, they are just trying to save face.
LaxAtlDfwYow

The Speaker's ruling is being turned into a joke by the Cons' deceits and the Liberals having devolved into invertebrates. The only precedent being set here is that a government can apparently ignore such rulings and Parliamentary orders with impunity.

At this stage, there is no reason for the Libs to push for (what will inevitably be) a weak agreement. No upside to that, since it will be just too easy for the Cons to stall provision of the documents over the summer. So, the Libs should negotiate hard and be happy to have this remain an open issue until the fall. Better to leave the detainee issue on the table for a possible fall election than accept a useless agreement.

http://intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

The Speaker has earned a little "credit" in this situation, as well. NOBODY wanted the showdown that, by rights, was to take place upon the Speaker finding a prima facie case for a breach. Not the Speaker. Not the government. And, most bizarrely, not the individual members who rose on the point of privilege in the first place.

Thwim

Agreed.

Now.. what can be done about it? I believe the point where the Speaker left it means that a point of order could force this whole thing forward, am I correct? Who's the most likely to want to see this thing forced forward. Not the Liberals or the Conservatives, they both stand to lose. That leaves us with the Bloc, the NDP, or the Independants.

Now the Bloc and the NDP are both somewhat on the inside on this thing.. which leaves the independants.

I wonder if we know of any independant MP who might be holding a grudge against this particular government.. perhaps someone who also is at risk of some sort of allegations of scandal coming out that might tarnish ~~her~~their re-election attempt if this government is allowed to drag things out for too long before an election.

Anybody here know somebody in Simcoe-Grey they could convince to write a letter to their MP?

http://intensedebate.com/people/avr avr

It must be depressing to have to hope for a loose cannon wanting petty vengeance in order to accomplish your political goals.
Wallace Cleaver

It must be depressing not to be able to appreciate a humourous post for what it is.
http://intensedebate.com/people/Thwim Thwim

It is. That's what this government (and here I include the opposition) has brought us to, unfortunately.

On the bright side, at least I know I'm not so blindingly partisan that I no longer care about how our parliament works so long as it doesn't harm a particular party.
http://intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

I believe the point where the Speaker left it means that a point of order could force this whole thing forward, am I correct? Indeed, I can't see how the Speaker could refuse, unless he wants to continue to exert his illegal supremacy over the supremacy of Parliament.

Who's the most likely to want to see this thing forced forward. By rights, I suppose it should be any of the trio of MPs who raised the initial point of privilege. If memory serves, there was one from each party.
http://intensedebate.com/people/madeyoulook madeyoulook

On this side of the looking glass, I figure each and every one of those three MPs should be pulling their hair out for being denied their parliamentary rights once the prima facie case was noted by the Speaker. So these three MPs are parliamentary failures (with a dash of collateral responsibility belonging to their caucus mates, too), or else they are just as relieved as everybody else that the motion of contempt pin is safely back in the grenade. Which means they are irresponsible parliamentarians for having raised the issue in the first place. The charges are not to be taken lightly, so if you really want to pull that pin, you had bloody well have already thought about throwing the damn grenade.

Out There

The Liberals may be invertebrates, but I picture this scenario:

- The Conservatives stonewall, and invoke some obscure clause or loophole to deny Parliament the documents.
- The Liberals force an election.
- The Conservatives win another minority.
- The Conservatives deny Parliament the documents again, but with added taunting.

Couple that with the realization that the NDP aren't exactly trustworthy allies – Layton will happily stick a shiv in Ignatieff's back if he sees an opportunity for the NDP to supplant the Liberals – and Ignatieff is in an awful corner.

The only real possibility of change is if the general public becomes outraged enough about the Conservatives' political shenanigans to cause them to lose enough seats to lose power if an election is called. I don't think we're there yet.

danby

Ahhh…another feather in Mr Ignatieff's crap

tobyornotoby

This isn't "progress." This is no different than the foot dragging and excuse making seen before the Speaker's ruling. We can't claim progress until the documents are delivered.

As far as I can tell we've gone backwards because the Liberal Opposition now seems ready to collude with the government to cover up the detainee affair.
http://intensedebate.com/people/Open_Democracy Open_Democracy

They are just hoping the sweaty masses are too stupid to remember how important this story was 4 short weeks ago….

….what story were we talking about again?….
http://viableopposition.blogspot.com/
http://intensedebate.com/people/PolJunkie PolJunkie

I'm disgusted.