Politics all the way down

COYNE: Stop crediting the Tories with scruples they show no sign of possessing

by Andrew Coyne on Monday, November 15, 2010 6:00am - 169 Comments
Politics all the way down

Pawel Dwulit/CP

The story is told of the farmer who had an axe: a fine, handsome axe, of which he was very fond. Why, it had been in his family for generations. Mind you, over the years they’d had to replace the head twice and the handle three times, but to the farmer it was still the same axe his grandad split logs with.

The reaction to the Conservatives’ now extensive history of replacing their principles with something more convenient strikes me as similar. After each abrupt reversal of field, each casual discarding of the principles of a lifetime, the discussion centres on how hard this decision must have been for the Tories, how it “went against their principles.”

Yes, there’s nothing quite as hard as expediency, is there? Someday, historians will write about those Tory ministers who, under pressure, had the courage to do the wrong thing. Still, after so many such examples, it might occur to someone that these are their principles: not the ones they are presumed to have, based on past statements, but the ones they actually practice.

I’m not just talking about the party membership, the long-suffering Conservative base, who seem willing to put up with just about anything. I’m talking about the media. No matter how many times the Tories kit themselves out with new convictions, opposed to the old, the commentariat still cling to the belief that, in fact, it’s still the same axe.

This is a remarkable feat. Stephen Harper’s Tories can run $56-billion deficits, raise spending to all-time record levels, and grease every Conservative riding with layers of pork; they can abandon Afghanistan, coddle Quebec, and adopt the NDP approach to foreign investment; and still there exists in people’s minds another Conservative party, somewhere, for whom these policies are anathema.

I suppose it’s possible these other Conservatives exist in theory, as a kind of Platonic ideal form. And so the principles commonly ascribed to them may also be said to exist, as abstractions. But if they never actually act on them, of what real-world significance are they? How is it meaningful to talk about them?

Perhaps there may once have been this great tension between Harper In Reality and the Harper Who May Exist in Theory, wrestling with each other over every great decision. Probably it was a struggle, jettisoning long-held convictions for short-term political gain—the first couple of times. But after the 50th or 60th time I can’t imagine he even notices. So we should stop pretending he does: stop crediting the Tories with scruples they show no outward sign of possessing.

It’s not as if this is anything new, after all. The Tories have been signalling their disdain for principled politics for—well, since their founding, or indeed before. The lesson the party’s leadership drew from the Reform-Alliance experience was not that these parties had been undisciplined or ill-led, but that they had been too radical, too honest, too principled. And the lesson they had absorbed from the Liberals’ success was the corollary. So: make no promises, if you can, or if you must make some, do not be bound by them, or indeed by anything else. And now we have two such parties.

The consequence of all this realpolitik, oddly, is more or less to make politics extinct in this country, or at least redundant. The forms are maintained, the rituals are observed, but without purpose or urgency, the kind that motivates activists and inspires voters. To be perfectly clear: absolutely nothing is at stake in Canadian politics. There is no clash of visions, no conflict of values, because neither party has any. Nothing is riding, therefore, on the outcome of any election. It simply does not matter who wins.

Well, it does, but not in any way that is relevant to the voter: that is, whatever policies a given party or leader might enact after the election, in response to whatever random events or pressure groups, they must remain an impenetrable mystery before the election, or indeed at any time until the moment they are enacted. The analogy here would be with the stock market: it obviously matters what stocks you own, but you’ve no way of knowing how they will perform in advance. You might as well pick them at random. Likewise, I defy anyone to predict what the Conservatives—or Liberals—would do on any given issue. Certainly nothing they say or do beforehand should be taken as evidence of anything. Therefore no one who is not actually paid to follow politics should pay it any serious attention. It is not worth your time, except as a diversion.

I admit I have been as reluctant to admit this as anyone. My whole career has been based on the proposition that somewhere, under all the insults and lying and general bad behaviour that makes up the bulk of political life, there was some genuine issue at stake: that if you could just strip away the politics, you would eventually get to the policy. It has taken me all these years to understand that, no, it’s just politics all the way down.

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  • kcm

    All of those quotes could quite easily buttress AC's "present" view: that those who came in like lions with much promise of accountability and strong principles are now acting like sheep with a marked aversion for accountability and highly elastic principles. All you've achieved is point out even a top journo like Coyne can get it very wrong – but then, as the say, hindsight is 20/20.
    In destoying the one party system i doubt Coyne meant emasculating yourself and your party by offering to be the new NGP liberals, rather than a principled alternative. The system has changed Harper – not the other way around.

    • westmalle

      Agreed. Coyne's analysis is exactly the same. Just in 2004 it was a good thing, now he thinks it is a bad thing. Harper hasn't changed, but Coyne has. In 2004 he was with National Post, now he is with MacLean's?

      Harper knows exactly what Canadians (voters, as opposed to magazine editors and newspaper columinsts) want, l(L)iberal government without the corruption. If it wasn;t for corruption Paul Martin would be into his third majority government right now. With potash decision and with Afghan training mission, we see this – the Conservative-Liberal de facto coalition at work. Next year's budget will doubtless have a home care tax credit in it, the Liberals will support it. Like Coyne said on At Issue last year…no election until 2012.

      Coyne wrote in aftermath of 2006 election (with Harper's surprise breakthrough with 10 Quebec seats) that the old Liberal-Bloc dynamic was ending and that "the ice floes are beginning to move in Quebec in directions that we cannot as of yet discern." That's still true. Canadian politics is static right now but the only place where there is potential for change is Quebec. Now if Marois is ousted and Duceppe goes to Quebec City to be new PQ leader, and Ignatieff Liberals continue to be as weak as they are in Quebec outside Montreal, then things could get interesting. Harper is focussing on the Bloc, not the Liberals.

      • kcm

        I still don't see what you evidently see in those quotes.

        "But if it comes to a conflict between the two-between advancing his own policy agenda and entrenching the Conservatives as permanent contenders for power-he will unhesitatingly choose the latter."

        He mentions entrenching Consevatives not faux liberals as contenders…or

        " …and his truer ambitions are to destroy the one-party system, forever: to set Canada permanently on a two-party track'

        Again he mentions a two party tack – presumes a distinction between libs/cons.

        Harper has burned his bridges in Quebec – not perhaps not the CPC, but Harper for sure.

      • TwoYen

        This is interesting analysis.

        You should aso consider that the NDP is picking up strength in Quebec largely at the expense of the Liberals, but it is possible they may also be picking up soft Bloc support on the left.

  • rocky

    That was stupid. If Coyne doesn't get a libertarian government, then he says all is lost? That`s stupid. No wonder it's not worth reading these things.

  • Emily

    In other words….be careful what you wish for or you may get it.

    And then, you won't like it.

    • Claudia Lemire

      Oh, god, just thinking Layton as PM, gives me the chills….

      • SamDavies

        It never ceases to amaze me how much this type of thought is entrenched in many people's minds. Some people can actually support the bias via comprehension of policy, while others simply buy into the whole "bah – he's a socialist" mindset. It saddens me that Canada often emulates the USA style of democracy, which consists of two flavours that pretty much taste the same more often than not…

        • Claudia Lemire

          It has nothing to do with the NDP, I have voted NDP twice before (Gary Doer in Winnipeg) to me it's about Layton, I have lost respect for him, I thought he was the moral conscious of this country, not anymore! I think he has made it personal, so it isn't even just politics!

  • interleper

    Seems like Andrew Coyne one of Harpers biggest cheerleaders is waking up to the reality of what Harper is all about and its left him feeling a bit bitter about the whole experience. As far as I’m concerned it couldnt happen to a more deserving guy.
    When you play with fire you will get burned. Stings dont it.

  • JDot

    Coyne says

    "My whole career"..

    LMAO, dude you are pundit. You comment on other peoples careers. SMFH, come on, you are no different then a sports writer, just a different subject.

    You are just some guy who never made it, commenting on other people who have. Projecting your views from the sidelines just like all the people in the comment section. The difference is you get payed, to play monday morning QB…

    • LdKitchenersOwn

      Isn't it more like Tuesday morning QB?

      After all, it's usually best to give the Tories at least 48 hours to see where they'll land.

    • Be_rad

      Arguably, he gets PAID because he is a better writer THAN your average person in the comment section.

  • simonb

    I disagree. It's not so much what the Cons have done in power – it's all about what they have not done (passively aggressively)…have you heard them doing anything positive with respect to :

    - Improving healthcare
    - Systemically improving the lot of First Nations
    - Improving the Environment
    - Childcare / Early childhood education
    - Aid to Africa

    The sad part is that not content with tearing down Canada's world standing on these issues, the COns have also a well funded well oiled media machine ready to attack (personally if necessary) anyone who stands up to speak on these issues.

  • NiceGuy

    Ask Gordon Campbell what happens when you allow policy to trump political expediency.

    The government appears to be mushy and rudderless because Canadians are mushy and rudderless. Show pictures of military equipment falling apart or helicopters falling out of the sky and Canadians are embarrassed and demand something be done. Spend money on military equipment and the public squeals about overspending.

    You can't even get 40% of Canadians to agree on what day of the week it is…yet you expect one man to govern a country in a way that satisfies everyone AND remains true to an ideological base.

    Canadian 'journalists' *eye roll*

    • LdKitchenersOwn

      Ask Gordon Campbell what happens when you allow policy to trump political expediency.

      Is it just me, or did you just champion the Gordon Campbell school of politics (campaign on one thing, do the opposite)?

      • NiceGuy

        The statement was sarcastic, not a blueprint for political maneuvering. It was just to point out that if you are going to go with your principles rather than what is politically popular, you may pay the price. Getting rid of the long-form census was apparently unpopular, but it hasn't cost the Tories anything. Campbell rolled the dice and lost.

  • NorthernPoV

    "Likewise, I defy anyone to predict what the Conservatives—or Liberals—would do on any given issue. "
    On a mid to long term basis, I'd agree but in the short term, prediction is easy if you have access to the same polling data.
    What is the solution to end the malaise we live in?
    Ban polling!
    When the pols don't have the pollsters to tell them what to say (or what silly policy to implement if they happen to hold power) …. they might just have to lead… and then let the people pick their leaders and representatives
    (instead of pols rushing to the head of the parade)
    Israel bans polling during the final stage of the election. A good start.
    Make political polling illegal as it is a monster-mutated-attempt at direct democracy that is at the very heart of the malaise.

  • http://3edgesword.blogspot.com FACLC

    A lot of this too seems to be the Opposition just grasping at opposing whatever choice between two options the Conservatives did choose.

    The policy about media at military funerals, for example. There were good arguments for and against, but no matter which one the Conservatives picked it was the other one the Liberals insisted was the right move.

    Then the half-mast policy on Parliament Hill. The choice was either crack down or do nothing, and you could easily spend hours in Debate Club arguing the pros and cons of each. Once the Tories made their decision, the opposition suddenly saw only the cons.

    From the medical isotope decision to Potash, whether you personally took one side or the other it was easy to see where the other guys were coming from. Then, bizarrely, the Liberals (and on occasion, the NDP) would insist that it was clearly wrong to do it Harper's way.

  • http://twitter.com/pmoharper pmoharper

    The right vs left paradigm is, as Coyne points out, a manufactured distraction.

  • Russell Barth

    a Harper Majority is inevitable. Canadains are too stupid to vote this monster out. they are under a spell. harper should have been dragged from his bed and dragged through the streets for what he has already done. one shudders to think what he will do when – not IF, but when – he gets his majority.

    • NiceGuy

      One can only hope!

    • craigola

      I don't really get this "monster" business, not when it's being used to describe people who might conceivably be described as monsters, and certainly not when it's being used to describe the Prime Minister. I don't agree with a lot of what the guy says and does, but the majority of the Canadian electorate "are under a spell"? Hogwarts called. You're out past curfew. Get on your broom and fly, little wizard.

  • Stan L

    "The analogy here would be with the stock market: it obviously matters what stocks you own, but you’ve no way of knowing how they will perform in advance. You might as well pick them at random. Likewise, I defy anyone to predict what the Conservatives—or Liberals—would do on any given issue. "

    Actually, you do how your stocks will perform….at least to a degree. And once you critically analyse the performance of said stocks you make your changes or stay the course accordingly based on the information you have about the company at the time.

    Such SHOULD be the case with picking a party to support. I would suggest that HAD the media critcally analysed Harper's career that he would not have been put on such a high pedastal in the first place. I would also suggest that the media had spent a little more time actually anlaysing their own assumptions and motivations that we wouldn't be in this facile and weird place where someone has to be the good or bad guy.

    Are the liberals and the conservatives different? of course they are both in policy and in approach……one does have to do the legwork though to cut through the biggest barrier we have to finding out information and that is the media……

  • Stewart_Smith

    I know Coyne has a fan club almost as loyal as Stein's but…

    There is a clear difference between the Liberals and the Conservatives, but it is certainly not the simplistic right-left economic/social stuff that is often assumed. Both parties have attracted too many pragmatic centralists to make dramatic moves towards their ideological roots and moreover there actually has been some progress in Canadian politics.
    (I suspect that anyone having the nerve to ask Trudeau what one of his programs would cost would have been told to fuddle off)

    In my view, the big difference between the two parties is the litmus test they most often use to decide if a policy is correct.

    For Liberals, it is the consensus of fancy, smart people with lots of letters behind their name. A Liberal might describe this as evidence-based policy development ; a Conservative would describe it as being told what to do by overbearing elites (from Toronto no doubt!)

    For Conservatives, the litmus test is the reaction of mainstreet. A Liberal would likely view the resulting marketing as the dumbing down of political discourse… a Conservative thinks of it as democracy at work.

    • Be_rad

      I'm going to enjoy how people react to this comment – thumbs up, or thumbs down? You apply equal opportunity dissing/compliments depending on your point of view. Like being told to pee in the corner of a round room.

      • Stewart_Smith

        it is a sort of experiment… don't tell anyone!

    • LdKitchenersOwn

      How would you square the "reaction of mainstreet" test with the Afghanistan reversal, given that polls say that 60% oppose the Afghanistan mission and a plurality oppose a non-combat extension past 2011? I think that litmus test explains the Tory rhetoric on Afghanistn from 2008 to last week PERFECTLY; this week's decisions, not so much (though admittedly, it's in no way a big deal politically for the Tories, so I don't mean to suggest there's any real RISK, I just find it weird that the Tories spent two years positioning themselves to the left of the Liberals on Afghanistan and then just flipped one weekend, out of the blue).

      Maybe they're just trying to keep people off balance, like when the PM promised never to take us back into deficit a couple of months before we went back into deficit, or how, after promising never to appoint a Senator, he put his first appointed Senator straight into cabinet.

      • Stewart_Smith

        Harper's first instinct was not to "cut and run" and I believe this is still his personal view. As you note Mainstreet pushed him to use Manley to depoliticize Afghanistan, and then to hide behind Parliament's deadline until very recently. I suspect external pressures, mostly from the US (my guess would be through military channels) have risen to extraordinarily high levels. Even though they have flipped, the Conservatives are largely crediting the Liberals with this extension (I heard MacKay speaking warmly of Rae and Ignatieff just this morning.) So yes they are going against Mainstreet, but they have made every attempt to place the Liberals in front of them. Note this is in contrast to the stimulus package. One doesn't hear much talk for the Conservative party about how the coalition forced them to save the economy. (Although it continues to come up from their core supporters)

        Politically this is not a bad move. It might cost them a few votes, but it will move a lot of anti-war Liberals over to the NDP.

  • WANTMYCOUNTRYBACK

    Excellent article. Finally the media might come around. If it finally buys into the indisputable fact the Harper government stands for nothing more than one man's personal political gain? Then maybe, just maybe the media will return to what is once was, the fourth estate, that scrutinizes this Harper government rather than make excuses for it , or simple ignore issues that Canadians should know about.

    Now let's call an election and see if Coyne's money is where his mouth is.

  • http://graysinfo.blogspot.com Stephen J. Gray

    Right on the political mark, Mr. Coyne. I believe it has reached the stage in this country, that we cannot trust or afford any politicians. Any suggestions in what we could replace them with?

    • fedup Canadian

      give it a break. you moron. It's easy to slander all the leaders in opposition and their peers with the Harper brush of deceit and lies. You pathetic…tell you what…next election day stay home and pound sand…you're vote will probably mean as much.

  • What's the answer

    The conclusion is, whoever is elected is irrelevant, so instead of influencing government through voting for a part of principles, we should find other means to steer government action.

    Should average citizens form lobby groups? Join existing lobby groups?

    What about lawsuits?

    Political protest?

    For conservatives, should we focus on reducing any-and-all taxes because at least that slows or boxes in the liberal/conservative governments?

    Any ideas?

  • pnw

    Are so many reporters/journalists/pundits too lazy to research the veracity of Harper's (or any other politician's) pronouncements, or too stupid to understand what they would find if they did?

    In any case, it seems to me that there is a significant difference between the Harper Conservatives and any other federal party now or in the past: Harper is obsessed with not just defeating, but with obliterating the Liberals. That fact changes the game considerably because everything he says and does is driven by his obsession, not with what's best for the country or even his party. Whenever he says or does something that seems reasonable, I can't help but wonder what the poison pill will be.

    • Claudia Lemire

      He will bring the Liberal party to it's knees, make no mistake about that!

      • Mike T.

        Wanna put money on that, kiddo?

        • Claudia Lemire

          Absolutely!!!

    • Holly Stick

      I think his religious extremism is coming out more and more, as well. Look at how he cares more about Israel than he does about Canada.

  • ColdStanding

    Confucius says: Man who makes living writing about politics ends up not knowing what to ink.

  • Devin

    Your totally right, somewhere along the way we let our politicians treat us like mere consumers. Instead of representing us in parliament they represent their brand. We need to become stakeholders again.

  • Holly Stick

    The contemptible Conservative Senators have killed a climate bill that was passed by the majority of the House of Commons.
    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/otta…

    • FVerhoeven

      Most perfect: one phoney body defeating one phoney policy.

      Virtually unheard of!

  • FVerhoeven

    Andrew, don't be too disappointed in Canadian politics. What you describe above is 'a-happening' world-wide.

    How to expect a clash of visions or how to expect a conflict of values if it's precisely the vision and the set of values which altogether have entered into that untanglible single point of vanishing?

    How to have a vision beyond the15-minutes-of-fame-time-frame, or how to behold a set of values during a 5-second-sound-bite-meeting-its-deadline?

    You think anyone in the east or west (or wherever; be it Taliban or Liberals) can remain in power outside such time restictions imposed? I don't think so.

    We, the people, demand it, now! We, as the people, have changed.

  • Jace

    I always figured I was the socio-demographic poster boy citizen. NEVER missed a vote. Have voted in countless elections in 4 provinces. Voted in 3 Québec referendums. Always knew the players, even without a score card. Actually was motivated to hear and meet politicians in person. Studied politics for fun. Was a member of the Trudeau Liberals as a teen, but never again after.

    Now, I don't think I am going to bother to vote anymore. Got better things to do. Seriously.

  • Jace

    I always figured I was the socio-demographic poster boy citizen. NEVER missed a vote. Have voted in countless elections in 4 provinces. Voted in 3 Québec referendums. Always knew the players, even without a score card. Actually was motivated to hear and meet politicians in person. Studied politics for fun. Was a member of the Trudeau Liberals as a teen, but never again after.

    Now I don't think I am going to vote anymore. Seriously. I have better things to do.

  • SamDavies

    "Maclean's is Canada's only national weekly current affairs magazine. Maclean's enlightens, engages, and entertains 2.4 million readers with strong investigative reporting and exclusive stories from leading journalists in the fields of international affairs, social issues, national politics, business and culture."

    I apologize for this off topic post, but given the set-up here (where you can't generate a topic, and can only comment on what is existant), I'm not really sure how else to bring this issue up. As such, I will post this in several threads, in the hopes that I will obtain some sort of a response regarding my concerns.

    Why is it that Maclean's (owned by Rogers Communications) DOES NOT report on issues pertaining to the politics of Canadian telecom? I'm trying not to buy into idle conspiracy theories, but I do find it odd that there is zero reporting of any sort, never mind any advocacy of an actual position. I find this extremely bothersome, as I believe this is an important debate, and I would like to hear the opinions of various people here on these issues.

    Yesterday, the Honourable Tony Clement, PC, MP, Minister of Industry presented his "Interim Report on the Digital Economy and Telecom Strategies". http://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/ic1.nsf/eng/06098.ht…

    Various media outlets reported on this – why would Maclean's choose to ignore it? Why does this "current event" not make the cut? No offense – but I think it is horrible that this magazine places so much focus on the pageantry of Canadian politics, and then completely ignores political/legislation issues that have real consequences for Canadians.

    To be clear – I don't expect my opinions or views to be universal – I just find it bothersome that Maclean's has taken a stance to ignore discussion pertaining to Canadian telecom matters. The fact that Maclean's ownership has a direct stake in this makes things all the more suspicious. Is this a deliberate policy, or does the Maclean's editor simply not consider such political issues newsworthy? Inquiring minds would like to know.

  • SamDavies

    Good article – nice to get people thinking this way. I wish the cheerleaders would have strength and courage to call them out on this more often, but instead, more often than not, they opt to buy into their preferred myth of "at least they are better than the enemy". I have no problem with people supporting whoever they want to support – but they should be willing to call them out on the BS instead of muttering "Baaaaaa". Instead of entrenching yourself in the never-ending battle with the enemy, work towards making your side better.

  • Brian

    Agreed, with sadness, regret and disgust.

    I just came here, btw, after reading an article elsewhere about how Tory Senators are suddenly, cheerfully using tax dollars to send ten-percenters. Great job, "tax-fighter" turned Senator Bob Runciman.

    Which Common Sense Revolution were we a part of, again?

  • hosertohoosier

    The two parties absolutely have predictable and different agendas, they just don't fit into a left-right picture. The Liberals will do what is in the interests of core Liberal regions (plus a few swing regions), as will the Conservatives. Lets take an issue that really did divide the parties – the green shift debate of 2008. In many respects, the Liberal proposal was the kind of policy we would expect from the right: cut income/corporate taxes, and raise (regressive) taxes on consumption. The Conservative response was to propose explicit controls, though of course they never did much. That hardly sounds less statist – what's the deal?

    The deal is that the Liberals represent regions that use less oil (and don't sell oil), while the Tories represent regions that use more oil and/or sell oil (with the exception of Newfoundland, where the Liberals were able to exploit the Atlantic accord issue successfully). Canadian politics are core vs. periphery not right vs. left. Harper, personally, is on the right no doubt, but the structure of Canadian politics and the coalition of interests he holds together prevents him from acting on his personal ideology.

    A significant source of the "unprincipled" actions Coyne speaks of regards policy on residual issues. The only reason Coyne believes the Conservatives have betrayed their principles is that he doesn't understand what the principles of the Tory party are and have been since they exchanged electorates with the Liberals (around Diefenbaker's time in office). If we want to hold our political parties to account, it would help to talk about Canadian politics in terms that reflect what actually goes on in Ottawa: bargaining between regional interests.

  • Emily

    Both parties will say and do whatever gets them votes….it has nothing to do with left/right or oil or anything else.

  • kcm

    "Canadian politics are core vs. periphery not right vs. left"

    That's an interesting POV, do you have a source for it – not saying i agree with your thesis…not without evidence.

  • westmalle

    More important than votes (between elections) is support and donations. Conservatives have a massive fund-raising advantage over Liberals. Why? Because people give money to the party whose policies they support. Liberals are falling further and further behind they need to attract supporters who will donate. But the pool is getting smaller – people who don't like what the Liberals say or do will not donate. I noticed today on Power Play how calm and deferential Ujjal Dosanjh was to Laurie Hawn on the Afghan mission extension – this was the same Ujjal Dosanjh who last Chistmas was accusing Canadian troops of being war criminals and the Prime Minister as being a tyrant (this was during Andrew Coyne's "Parliament Will Fight" timeframe). The Liberals are looking beaten.

  • hosertohoosier

    So you think Harper would stand up to Canada's oil companies, if it was popular to do so? I ask because I'd say there would be political mileage for something like that.

  • samiam

    Quit repeating the lies and someone may listen to you. The 'war criminals' accusation is more Tory message twisting to fit their scorched earth platform, all the while getting the electorate to tune out and drop out…

  • kcm

    "But the pool is getting smaller – people who don't like what the Liberals say or do will not donate"

    That's conjecture – and self serving at that. It's well known libs are generally not as idealogical as cons or dippers – thus they're slower to open their wallets.[ no doubt overrelying on big business support has contributed to liberal parsimony]. Perhaps that'll have to change, although i hope not. I like the idea of a flexible, pragmatic, non- idealogical party.

  • westmalle

    Whatever.

    Ujjal was very quiet and sounding whipped today. Not the usual Ujjal. Laurie Hawn couldn't believe he was actually saying "I agree with Ujjal on this." Ujjal even told off the NDP member, telling him to wake up on the need for Canada to continue to support Afganistan. Laurie Hawn just smiled.

  • Orson Bean

    I also think it's interesting, and I think there's some truth to it. I mean, any historian or political scientist worth his/her salt will start a basic discussion of Canada by talking about the regional aspect. It's a huge part of our history and political character. Consider Trudeau, and why he is and was revered in certain parts of Central Canada, while conversely loathed in the West. Trudeau and his electoral architects Jim Coutts and Keith Davey designed (largely successful) political campaigns around this regional aspect ("Screw the West, take the rest" was the catchphrase for this emphatically regionally-based strategy). The legacy of that Trudeau strategy continues to this day, with Alberta being the most solidly dependable Conservative region, and Toronto being the Liberal heartland.

  • hosertohoosier

    You can look at how the supporters of the big parties break down ideologically, on a positioning scale for one. In the 2006 WVS:

    Conservatives
    Left (1-4): 8.2%
    Centre (5-6): 51.3%
    Right: (7-10): 38.3%

    Liberals
    Left (1-4): 19.3%
    Centre (5-6): 50.8%
    Right: (7-10): 29.9%

    Or, if you think people don't understand right vs. left (which in itself should be telling about our political system), lets look at the class right-left question: private vs. government ownership.

    Conservative
    Private ownership should be increased (1-4): 62.3%
    Middle (5-6): 23.3%
    Government ownership should be increased (7-10): 14.2%

    Liberals
    Private ownership should be increased (1-4): 51.2%
    Middle (5-6): 31.3%
    Government ownership should be increased (7-10): 17.5%

    So, ideology matters very little in Canadian politics. This is how guys like Keith Martin, Scott Brison, Dennis Mills and Tom Wappel could all find a home in Canada's centre-left party (although thanks to strong party discipline they rarely pushed for their ideological goals).

    This contrast sharply with the regional divides you see in every Canadian election. Most Liberal support comes from the core, ie. Canada's 3 biggest cities. The Conservatives, in turn, sweep rural Canada, while the two fight it out for seats in suburban areas. In Quebec it is the same, except that the Bloc is the party of the periphery, while the Liberals are the party of the core. You can also see it in the issues that tend to rise to the forefront in Canada:

    -free trade (historically), which pitted the export-competitive periphery against the import-competing core
    -the persistent unity question/federal provincial relations
    -the gun registry
    -the NEP/the carbon tax debate (energy producing periphery vs. core)
    etc.

  • kcm

    All true. Although it's important to keep in mind context – the political reality of those times.[ which sort of confirms H/H thesis] The hard fact of the numbers game game was that only Ontario and Quebec had political resonance for much of Trudeau's time. AS a westerner and Trudeau admirer i have long held the view that it was a curious and sad [ for Canada] failing from such a savvy politician. But that was both his strengh and his great failing, the ability to live in the now. I suppose he thought his successors could worry about the future.

  • RossM

    The Common Sense is, once in power, it's only common sense to do anything you can to stay there, to the direct & indirect, tangible & intangible benefit to you, your friends, family & fellow-travelling ideologues (read: tribe).

    Where's the mystery in that?

  • Rob Shift

    The one that says that it is common sense to assume that politicians will say, and do, anything to gain and retain power.

  • Jenn_

    Hear, Hear!

  • kcm

    Interesting – although i don't know if it hold s up when you overlay a proportional vote model on the country.

  • hosertohoosier

    True – PR would change who gets elected and what incentives they have. It would probably change Canada somewhat from a country of ideological brokerage and regional conflict to one of ideological conflict and regional brokerage.

  • kcm

    Personally i'd like to see a Proportonally elected HOC with [ perhaps elected] strong regional senate. Failing that at least some sort of run-off electoral system. We definitely need a made in Canada solution.

  • kcm

    I think i'll take choice # 2: Idealogical conflict and regional brokerage – if i have to.

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