Beyond The Commons

Aaron Wherry covers all the goings-on in and around Parliament Hill. Follow Aaron on Twitter: @aaronwherry

Categories: Beyond The Commons, Capital Read

Take that, Pierre Trudeau

by Aaron Wherry on Tuesday, December 7, 2010 4:06pm - 72 Comments

That weekend in Toronto is bestowed an historic epitaph courtesy of the Ontario ombudsman.

For the citizens of Toronto, the days up to and including the weekend of the G8/G20 will live in infamy as a time period where martial law set in the city of Toronto, leading to the most massive compromise of civil liberties in Canadian history, and we can never let that happen again,” André Marin told reporters Tuesday.

The full report is here.

Tags: Andre Marin, civil liberties, G20, Ontario ombudsman, protest, Toronto

More by Aaron Wherry

http://intensedebate.com/people/Ottawa_Centrist Ottawa_Centrist

I am glad Blair didn't have access to tanks.

CAPS

I ususally like Chief Blair and was very, very disappointed by many of his pre and post G-20 statements.

The only thing I can say in his defence is that it appears that the most egregious offences by the Police were done by Cops from other forces (Calgary, York etc.)

Rob Shift

it appears that the most egregious offences by the Police were done by Cops from other forces (Calgary…

As a Calgarian, can I say that I'm not surprised in the least? I have a cousin that was just hired with the CPS. The guy's an alpha-male, small-dicked, douchebag. And he'll fit right in.

craigola

I'm telling him you said that.

Holly Stick

Actually, what is the source for saying the cops were from Calgary, etc.? I searched the ombudsman's report for "Calgary" and it's not mentioned there.
Crit_Reasoning

There is no source. I checked it, too. I have no idea why CAPS chose to single out the Calgary police, but based on media reports and activist accounts, he or she is clearly wrong.
Rob Shift

Oh noes, if I don't make it back after the break, its probably because I was tasered to death at Christmas dinner. I hate when that happens.

chriskayTO

It was probably mostly the OPP, in Fantino's final eff-you to the City and people of Toronto.

TJCook

I don't know about 'final'… seems to me that Fantino has scrabbled his way to access a whole new level of potential eff-yous to Toronto.

Mandatory Jedi

WAHHHHOOOOO……..WAHHHHHHOOOOO…..

Quick, somebody call the hyperbole police!

gottabesaid

Hate to break it to you, but Marin was actually criticizing the provincial Liberals, not the federal Tories. So, by accusing him of hyperbole, you're actually throwing your support behind the (…oh…no…) DARK SIDE!

In the words of Darth at the end of ROTS: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooooooo!

Mandatory Jedi

I could careless what party he's criticizing, someone seriously needs to call the hyperbole police before this situation gets any more out of control.

Is everyone either a Liberal or a Conservative in your world?

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes. I will do what I must."
―Obi-Wan Kenobi

gottabesaid

Actually, I have criticized both parties on this board in the past… today, in fact… but most (all?) of your posts have involved making fun of the Liberals — that's my impression at least. If I am wrong on that, I beg your forgiveness. I am but a lowly paduan, and not yet learned in the ways of the Force.
JonnyBoy

What a fantastic quote. I must remember and implement it!

Mulletaur

LMAO.

Guest

I guess the Liberals weren't too far off the mark with their infamous "Tanks in the Streets" video — not the military but the para-military.

Orson Bean

Except that they were talking about . . . the McGuinty Liberals?

Jenn_

I've been feeling for awhile now that McGuinty is copying every move Harper makes (or Harris, he gets to pick from the two). I wonder if we elected provincial PCs if we'd get Liberals? Or should we go with NDP? At least in BC they know the tags don't fit the ideology.

Crit_Reasoning

Is the decision by Dalton McGuinty's government to enact Regulation 233/10 really a worse breach of civil liberty than the War Measures Act? The War Measures Act imposed actual martial law and removed rights such as habeas corpus from all Canadians.

James Connors

Yes.

Not to argue for Trudeau's response to what was perceived as an armed insurrection was measured nor correct; merely to point out pushing Canadians around will get the government of the day a real kick in the ass – eventually.

Crit_Reasoning

Do you think Dalton McGuinty's government will get a "real kick in the ass" regarding Regulation 233/10? It's possible, but I'm not so sure. I guess we'll have to see how the McGuinty Liberals respond to the ombudsman's scathing critique of Ontario's Liberal government.

Jan

The War Measures was publicly invoked, it was totally known about by the citizenry. This little gem wasn't.

http://stumblingabordeaux.blogspot.com Pato31

Thanks for beating me to it. If you don't know the law – you can't challenge it.

Jan

I suspect most people would have stayed off the streets of Toronto if they'd known what power the police had that weekend. Of course that wouldn't have looked good with the world watching.

Mulletaur

Two fun questions for you : 1. How many people were arrested using these powers ? 2. How many people were charged using these powers ?

tobyornotoby

I deplore both decisions, but at least the War Measures Act was in response to actual versus potential violence.

DBM

His exact words are 'most massive compromise' -

If one assumes he's using the word 'massive' in its purely quantitative sense, then he may be correct. There were more than twice as many arrests made during the G20 as there were during the October Crisis. Whether all those arrests were made pursuant to this particular regulation I can't say.

tobyornotoby

"Whether all those arrests were made pursuant to this particular regulation I can't say."

We'll never know because most of them weren't charged, and we can't ask the arresting officers because they gave fake badge numbers. In any case it doesn't matter because the authorties including Chief Blair sent the message to the beat cops that the laws didn't count that weekend.

TJCook

I'm sure Blair is looking forward to his federal Conservative candidacy.

DBM

http://www.straight.com/article-331305/vancouver/…

According to this article the G20 was, in fact, the largest 'mass arrest' in Canadian History. More surprising, perhaps, is that the WMA doesn't even come in second.

kcm

Betcha it was the Claquot sound protests – no googling.

kcm

er…Clayoquot…guess that's what i get for not googling, bastard internet.

Katherine

There were more than twice as many arrests made during the G20 as there were during the October Crisis.

Wow. That alone is evidence that the cops went way, way overboard on this one.

Mike T.

The mere enactment of the regulation and its text – probably not. It may have been unconstitutional (as would the War Measures have been, had it been in effect) but aside from that the effect of the regulation itself would have been relatively small.

The abuse of power approved of, if not orchestrated, by Bill Blair and Conservative MP Fantino? Considerably worse.

DBM

While the enforcers certainly deserve some censure in all this, it's not like they were given an inch and took a mile. It's actually more like they were given several miles and decided to take an extra 5 meter perimeter.

The executives who gave them this power – elected individuals – should not escape blame. And they should remember this the next time the law enforcement, security and intelligence communities attempt to make the case that they need 'all the tools in the shed' to protect national security, public safety, ect. while implying that any powers given will be used with restraint.

wellwell

Wrong. Blair asked for the power, was given it, and then exceeeded it.

I note that Crit_Reasoning pins all the blame on the McGuinty Liberals – I will only blame them if they do nothing about these rogue cops. Enough is enough.

Mike T.

note that Crit_Reasoning pins all the blame on the McGuinty Liberals

***

That was his intent, as per ususal.

MostlyCivil

Mr Marin has been known to…umm…mangle his metaphors.

An example, from 2008:

"The Ministry of Health’s position is a little bit like a baritone, mellifluous voice telling you everything is just on track. Well, back at the ranch, the wheels are falling off the bus.”"

Righto…
Emily

The Ombudsman is out to lunch.

Emily

Sorry, thumb-monkeys but he is.

Crit_Reasoning

For what it's worth, Emily, I agree with you. Try telling the Japanese-Canadian WW2 internees that the G20 was the worst breach of civil liberties in Canadian history.

Richard_S_Argent

McGuinty's certainly has a knack for ticking off the Left, Right and Centre.

That being said, Hudak is a farce, Horvath is invisible, and my fair city is being run by a fool.

Good times, good times…

sigh.

Jan

Do not despair, we in B.C. are having our own problems.
gottabesaid

Are you one of those 'left-wing kooks' that Don Cherry was nobly referencing today at Rob Ford's swearing in?

Richard_S_Argent

actually I kinda suspect I am…et fier de l'être! :)

DBM

His efforts to be everybody's man are quickly making him nobody's man. That's for sure.

Jenn_

Is that what he's trying to do? I thought he was looking at Harper and saying to himself, "well, if it worked for him."

He seems to have forgotten that if we still wanted Harris, we wouldn't have kicked Eves out.

Leo

At least the citizens of Vancouver did something during the Olympics – as soon as the Black Bloc creeps started smashing windows, the peaceful protesters, bystanders and even journalists chased them down and pretty much put the boots to their antics. In Toronto they cheered them on and even protected them.

Jan

I watched the whole thing live. When the Black Shirts started to vandalize the riot squad was called in and got ready to move in and then were stood down. They completely blew it at that point. There was a security analyst doing commentary and he couldn't believe it – they had the BS's all together, clearly identified by their clothing and for some unknown reason the command stopped them from dealing with it.

Leo

JMHO but 'ghosts' of the 1994 Stanley Cup riot may have held them back. That was scary as the mood turned ugly within 15 minutes – never so happy to get on the seabus home before everything went crazy!

JonnyBoy

Okay, I just did a (somewhat) quick read through the ombudsman's report, and here are some thoughts that I would be interested in getting other's thoughts on:

First, I was hesitant, but have decided that I agree with the unconstitutional nature of the powers given to authorities. Looking back on it, denying entry would have been more than enough, without resorting to having to arrest people.

Second, I do not think it is helpful or useful to demonize the police so badly (not so much here, but take a gander at the CBC's readers comments on this story). They were, in the end, doing what they were told to do, were they not? They were told to ask people for ID, and if people refused, to arrest them. Presumably, that is what they did for the most part.

Third, it continues to strike me as strange that all the violence and destruction that happened during these "protests" (quotation marks because as soon as violence against property starts, it calls into question the legitimacy of the entire occasion) BY THE protestors is not talked about. I don't even want to imagine what would have happened by these hooligans (is that not what they are?) had the set up been more along the lines of permitting people into the security zone after checking their person for weapons. I mean lets face it, some people were a little unreasonable about their opposition to the G8/G20 and its meeting in Canada.

Which leads me, finally, to fourth, I just want to say that constitutional or unconstitutional, it still strikes me as strange that so many people would not simply show ID when asked for it. I know its a slippery slope to becoming like China and all of that, I get it. But still, had people who were simply "checking out the fence" simply showed some ID, they would have been allowed to continue to "check out the fence". At least that's how I read it.

Alright, looking foreword to being put in my place…

Leo

You are a brave soul JohnnyBoy – hope you are wearing your flak Jacket!!!!!
Leo

Here is a link from an expert – his analysis of the whole thing.
http://www.mackenzieinstitute.com/2010/g20-protes…

JonnyBoy

Brilliant…hope everyone takes the time to read it, or at least the "Conclusions and Observations". That is definitely the side of the story that is missing from all the mainstream "discussion"

Richard_S_Argent

One small point – the great majority of those arrested were nowhere near the perimeter fence.
kcm

'They were, in the end, doing what they were told to do, were they not? They were told to ask people for ID, and if people refused, to arrest them. Presumably, that is what they did for the most part.'

You presume little bit too much perhaps. What part of arbitrary search, arrest and beatings , tearing off your ID badge, is just doing what you were told?

Trudeau lover

When the great "Liberal" turd Trudeau took away everyones rights and put "soldiers on the streets", he did it in order to help assist him in implementing his nefarious secret agenda. When "Liberal" McSquinty took away everyone's rights he did it because he shares the ideological view that imposing "Marshall Law" is "Progressive". "Liberals" are funny, in a scary totalitarian way.

brooster2

"marshall" [sic] law…haha…that's funny…deputies with six-guns and badges?
frobisher

Is Marshall law kinda sorta like 'The Marshall Plan"? Was this all just some grand exercise is economic rehabilitation such that global stability might result? Well, then, all is forgiven!

Mulletaur

It's a Marshall Plan for the cops. Just imagine how many cops' kitchens have been redone and cottage decks built based on those overtime payments – now that's stimulus !

kcm

'When the great "Liberal" turd Trudeau took away everyones rights and put "soldiers on the streets", he did it in order to help assist him in implementing his nefarious secret agenda'

What agenda would that be? Let me see…oh oh i know…apprehending a perceived insurrection by some tin pot would be terrorists who felt that what was a death or two along the way to national independence.
Trudeau lover

Of course that should have been written, "martial law", my apologies. I appreciate the pointing out of this terrible error, I also thought the ha, ha's, were a nice touch.

Mulletaur

Your fingers probably slipped on your spittle covered keyboard.

Trudeau lover

Your expertise on "spittle", is unquestionable… much like your knowledge of what's slippery. Thanks Manure.

Mulletaur

I see you're still recovering from head injuries suffered during the G20. Best wishes.

Halo_Override

You certainly have demonstrated on many occasions your ability to correctly spell "turd".

Trudeau lover

I'm sure the word "turd" is a term your very familiar with.

Halo_Override

"you're"
Trudeau lover

"Turd"

David

Is this a contradiction? One side of the mouth " we have to listen to Chief Blair because he said the gun registry is needed" , other side of the month says " Chief Blair is a fascist carrying out mass arrest for no cause during the G20". Which is it ?
I firmly believe that the police have too much power and not enough oversight. If they can't be trusted to not falsely arrest people, as was the case during the G20 and as is coming to light in the city of Ottawa, they should not be trusted to correctly use a firearms registry which can be used to carry out searches without warrant.

kcm

'Which is it ?'

Both; people are complicated – doesn't make Blair a fascist though – silly to throw that loaded word around. Hyperpole, it sets up exactly the sort of false dichotomy you've outlined