Inkless Wells

 Inkless Wells

Paul Wells on all the latest out of Ottawa—along with the occasional post about jazz. Follow Paul on Twitter: @InklessPW
He also offers his thoughtful perspective of Stephen Harper’s last 10 years in his recent eBook, The Harper Decade.

Categories: Capital Read, Inkless Wells

France: Land of Conrad Black's dreams

by Paul Wells on Thursday, March 10, 2011 7:01am - 66 Comments

“And there is something Canada can do, which would be noticed by our allies: We should recognize the provisional government of Libya as legitimate, and make contact with it. This could have a catalytic effect, inspirit the rebels, nudge the Americans and Europeans into doing something, and generally start a rockslide around Gaddafi…. A gangster and terrorist regime is slaughtering its own population, which is fighting back gallantly. We owe them our support, and every day’s delay is shameful and could make a benign outcome more doubtful.

“For once, Canada could make a difference and be seen by the world to do so. There is no excuse for waiting.”

— Conrad Black, Saturday

 

“PARIS — Moving ahead of its allies, France said on Thursday that it would become the first country to recognize Libya’s rebel leadership in the eastern city of Benghazi and would soon exchange ambassadors with the insurgents.”

— New York Times, this morning

Sorry, boss. Waiting is all Canada does any more.

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  • http://myblahg.com Robert McClelland

    Conrad just doesn't understand that there are no votes for the Conservatives to be courted in Libya. If there were, Kenney would already be issuing made up awards emblazoned with the Con logo to the rebels.

  • McC_

    I am embiggened by Black's use of 'inspirit'

    • MikeB

      'inspirit' is a perfectly cromulent word.

      • Brian

        Cromulence is an underrated asset.

        • GeoffM

          The zaftiger the asset, the inspiriting the cromulence.

    • MediaBuff

      Black clearly has a bigger vocab than you.
      http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/inspirit

      He used the word correctly.

  • madeyoulook

    Wow. He's STILL your boss? You signed a crappy contract at the National Post many years ago, Paul.

    ;)

    • Inkless

      "Boss" these days is indeed a term of endearment, not contract law.

  • bergkamp

    "The Kurds also attest to the 'realist' betrayal of Iraq in 1991. As Coalition Forces were breaking the back of Saddam's army from the air, President George HW Bush's public suggestion to Iraqis, "to take matters into their own hands and force Saddam Hussein, the dictator, to step aside," encouraged Kurdish and Shiite uprising against the Baathist regime. George H.W. Bush and Baker provided no support and tens of thousands of Shi'a and Kurdish Iraqis were slaughtered in reprisal once the regime regrouped." Washington Post, Dec 2006

    I think diplomacy is a complete and utter waste of time and that's why the French excel at it.

    I have no problem with Canada waiting to see how things shake out before championing the freedom fighters because we don't know what US is going to do. I am far from convinced that Obama will have US military do much of anything and I worry that Western forces will encourage rebels, and in their time of need, the West will continue to sit on its hands and do nothing. Like what happened to the Kurds.

    If western powers are going to encourage people to rise up against oppression, we have to have their backs or we should shut up and stay out of it.

    • Claudia Lemire

      I think diplomacy is a complete and utter waste of time and that's why the French excel at it

      I kind of agree with you a little there, it is a waste sometimes, in this case ABSOLUTELY, it's taking them too long, and I don't know about the French in general but Sarkozy is very undiplomatic.

  • OriginalEmily1

    3.39pm: The EU has voted to recognise the Libyan national council in Benghazi, al-Arabiya is reporting.

    • Inkless

      "The government will join, notwithstanding its failure to prepare, its neglect in co-operating with its allies, or its inability to contribute. In the end it will join out of the necessity created by a pattern of uncertainty and indecision. It will not join as a leader but unnoticed at the back of the parade.”

      — Stephen Harper, April 2003

      • OriginalEmily1

        …and we know what the people at the back of a parade have to walk through.

        • McC_

          spent confetti…

          • OriginalEmily1

            You must be a city slicker

          • MostlyCivil

            Also depends if the reindeer are real or not…

          • OriginalEmily1

            Definitely a city slicker.

  • ColdStanding

    No, wait, now I get why we have moved our staging area to Cypress. Now we can be at the ready for any ____ going down.

    Seriously, though, if you are going to start backing the rebel council, then you'd better be ready to fight to victory, 'cause if M. G. win's he'll be miffed and looking for revenge.

    • Orson Bean

      Well, this is the thing. I'm very skeptical of all the armchair quarterbacks out there who think that "backing the rebels" is a simple matter. I thought that retired Gen. Lewis Mackenzie's piece in this morning's Globe was good reading in this regard:
      http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/opin…

  • madeyoulook

    A serious question:

    When this sort of thing goes on, isn't there a whole flurry of diplomatic backing and forthing between "allies," such that no Western country is terribly surprised that France went first? Might there even be a schedule set up? Every day or couple of days, another country announces it has finally told the tyrant he's toast, further demoralizing the tyrant and further emboldening the rebels.

    • Mike R

      That may be true, but as long as all the help that is offered remains diplomatic, and the rebels are left to try to stop T-72s with their Nissan sedans, I think the emboldening will be of limited duration. Hopefully plans are afoot to house the several hundred thousand Libyan refugees from Benghazi who will be seeking refuge in Egypt shortly.

      • OriginalEmily1

        Iraqis and Afghans managed to hold off an entire 'coalition of the willing', so Libyans can manage it against Gadaffi.

        • sourstud

          I'm not sure what's most wrong with that statement: comparing legitimate freedom fighters to a gang of Islamic terrorists and criminals, or comparing the Gaddafi regime to a western democracy.

          • OriginalEmily1

            It isn't a comparison of your wacky political beliefs, it's about the ability of a poorly armed insurgency to hold off a 'super-power'.

          • sourstud

            So because an under-dog has won a fight in the past, they will therefore win all fights in the future?

          • OriginalEmily1

            The US hasn't won anything since WWII

            Oh wait…Grenada. Snuck up on them in the middle of the night.

          • sourstud

            Korean War, The Cold War, Gulf War 1, and Bosnia come to mind as post-WWII American victories. And I certainly think it's too early to call Iraq or Afghanistan a "loss" for the US. But I'm sure you can predict the future.

          • OriginalEmily1

            They didn't win any of those, sorry.

            And yes, Iraq and Afghanistan are total losses.

            Everyone on the planet is aware of that except you apparently.

          • Orson Bean

            There's also Grenada and Panama. I don't think you can classify those as US military defeats. How you can see Gulf War I and Kosovo as anything other than US military victories is, well, intriguing.

          • OriginalEmily1

            You really should read threads first.

          • sourstud

            Do you actually believe that Saddam Hussein won the first gulf war? Or that the Russians won the Cold War? I'd be interested to see your sources.

          • OriginalEmily1

            You guys sure love to argue a lot of nonsense about war.

            Is it your age, lack of education or just boredom?

            The US didn't even win WWII by itself you know…it was an allied effort ….and the Americans turned up late at that after all the heavy lifting was done.

            Korea was fought to a standstill….which nevertheless lost N Korea for the west. The US lost Vietnam completely. Gulf War I was a joint effort….so was Bosnia

            The Soviets moved to Peristroika and Glasnost….and let their satellites go free. They could have stepped in, like they'd done many times before. No one was more surprised than the US when the Berlin Wall came down. LOL

            Maybe you just watched too many John Wayne movies.

          • sourstud

            Once again, you're moving the goalposts. The only one arguing nonsense about war is you. I simply pointed out the array of errors you've posted in this thread alone. And YOU responded by talking nonsense, and continue to do so.

            If "joint efforts" don't count, can you even list a single major military intervention that has taken place since WWII that was pursued unilaterally by the USA?

            Think, don't drink, before you type Em.

          • OriginalEmily1

            There are no goalposts to move….the thread is about Canada recognizing the Libyan council, and you've wandered off into movies.

            As to your question, yes. Vietnam. Total disaster.

            Now hit the books….you need the help.

          • sourstud

            What movies have I mentioned? You did say something about John Wayne, so it would seem you've wandered into the movies.

            And as for Vietnam, that's a terrible example.
            1) The French were in Vietnam before the US arrived.
            2) The Americans were there fighting to defend South Vietnam, along side South Vietnamese forces.
            3[a]) "Approximately 320,000 South Korean soldiers were sent to Vietnam"
            [b] "More than 60,000 Australian personnel were involved during the course of the war, of which 521 were killed"
            [c] "Some 10,450 Filipino troops were dispatched to South Vietnam"
            Source

            As Charlie Sheen would say… #Winning! Duh!

          • OriginalEmily1

            I'm not arguing Vietnam with you guy, I lived through it. You've seen Rambo movies.

            The shot you missed was the chopper escaping from the embassy roof as the Americans ran.

            Now discuss the actual topic here or depart.

          • sourstud

            Okay, you've now mentioned John Wayne, Rambo, and a highly publicized news shot of a helicopter, yet you accuse me of wandering into movies while I haven't mentioned a single movie.

            I discuss the topic at hand and reference sources for my information, and you tell me to shut up because you're old.

            I am discussing the topic, you clearly are not.

            #Winning

          • OriginalEmily1

            Topic:

            “And there is something Canada can do, which would be noticed by our allies: We should recognize the provisional government of Libya as legitimate, and make contact with it"

            Now go back to school, and stop boring the grown-ups.

            Ciao.

          • sourstud

            #Winning

  • TimesArrow

    Whaughhhhh!!!
    The French…those cheese eating surrender monkeys!!!

    You think waiting is easy Wells? You think being unnoticed at the back of the parade is a doddle eh, Conrad's poodle.

    S'pose you think that effete, latte swilling, coalition loving, Haaarvard smozing wimp Iffyneff could do better? Get real Conrade Wells.

    Oops…crap… wrong ID…let's see…Trudeau lover…nope…Whatzname from Houston…nope….Alfanerd…nah way too smart…Chet…ah…the oldies are always the best.
    Better add something bout todays progressive leftist media though?

    • MostlyCivil

      You missed ADSCAM. Tsk.

      • TimesArrow

        i'm keeping that back in case PW gets after me.

    • sourstud

      Now that you mention it…. what exactly has Iggy proposed Canada do differently in regard to Libya? You'd think as one of the "world's leading human rights experts", he might have something to say about a foreign dictator slaughtering his own people. But the best he can come up with is "Tsk, tsk". Is this what they teach at Harvard?

      • TimesArrow

        Good question. Pity he's the leader of the opposition…it might otherwise be his responsibility. But maybe the press should ask him anyway?

    • Claudia Lemire

      This is a political move by Sarkozy, he gets good ratings when he is this big hero when there is unjustice in the world and we know how much he loves that (Betancourt, Belgian nurses held in Lybia, Cassez).

      Having said that, I think Nato, allies have taken too long to do something, what are they waiting for?

      I think Gadhafi is more crazy than Saddam and expecting a good resolution Egypt style, is never going to happen, have seen psycho son?

  • s_c_f

    It would have been nice to see Canada step up first to recognize the end of the Qaddafi regime. Certainly that would have eliminated any possibility of a seat on the UN security council, but it would have been the right thing to do, to support the people of Libya in their quest to topple a dictator. They need all the help they can get.

    • chet

      A no fly zone,

      and if we happen to spot some of Quadafi's citizen murdering goon's out in the open, and can toast 'em with some cluster bombs,

      all the better.

  • chet

    Obama doesn't lead. Like let Nancy and Harry carry the load on the healthcare debacle,

    he'll try and let others carry the load on this.

    Canada needs to squeeze out that last bit of milage from our CF 18's, before we replace them with the vastly superior F35's

    and work with whoever will enforce a no fly zone. France, now England maybe.

    Canada, France and England could enforce it (assuming with landing rights nearby as we wouldn't have US carriers).

    Projection of power. The true freedom loving power. It still matters in this world.

  • hosertohoosier

    Recognition absolutely matters – anybody that says otherwise is a fool. It matters for trade aid and investment, it matters for Libya's UN representation, it matters for the perceptions of Libya's populace, and it matters for the ability of the west to sign treaties with Libya. There is a reason Taiwan and China have engaged in a costly bidding war for recognition by others. There is a reason Quebec separatists have pushed for sovereignty through accepted channels. Sovereign states enjoy special privileges in the international system, and so it matters which Libya we assign those rights to. Will it oust Gaddafi? No, but its a pretty good bang for our buck.

    • chet

      "Recognition" while the Libyan air force pounds them into smitherines, is the stuff of UN fantasy. Ahh yes, let us sit comfortably in the UN and simply wish the rebel forces to be the government…..

      Without force behind the "recognition", particularly when dealing with a brutal thuggish dictator, the words will mean nothing, or worse, they'll only embolden him.

      The West collectively has the most advanced superior armed forces in the history of humankind. To keep it safely parked while we watch civilians and freedom fighters get bombed, would simply be wrong.

  • Barry W

    So what happenms when Gaddafi wins? Conrad and his felon friends will lead the invasion? Harper has handled this exactly right.

  • Sigh

    Canada has made a difference and been seen by the world to do so. Just not lately.

  • OriginalEmily1

    Conrad Black promoted Stockwell Day for PM. Imagine the even worse disaster for Canada that would have been.

    Especially on anything to do with the Middle East.

  • John D

    Great, I agree with Conrad :(

  • Dot

    PARIS — Moving ahead of its allies, France said on Thursday that it would become the first country to recognize Libya’s rebel leadership in the eastern city of Benghazi and would soon exchange ambassadors with the insurgents.”

    Paris based Total must be happy.
    http://www.total.com/en/home-page-940596.html

  • TimesArrow

    Cool hand Wells…that's what Conrad used to call him at the post.

  • Dot

    [terrible thoughts of the NP urinals]

  • Canuck237503

    Gosh, can't Conrad decide where he wants to be. First, it was Canada. Then, when he got the title of Lord Almost, it was to ditch us all and move to the UK (or was it live in the US but be Lord Black anyway?) where he wrote articles saying how much Canada sucked. Then he spent some time in the US, courtesy of the American Government. Where he rediscovered his love for Canada and started writing articles about how the US sucks and Canada is the best. And now, France?

  • sourstud

    Are you sure you're talking about Conrad Black and not Michael Ignatieff? Because what you described could very easily be either one of them (what with Iggy having his vacation home in France).

  • Canuck237503

    Why is the only response anyone can ever make to criticism (and this was more just mocking) of a Tory, "Oh, well, the Liberals do it too!"

  • sourstud

    Because most of the time it's the Liberals that did it first.

  • Canuck237503

    That, however, does not make it right. I'm a Liberal (living in the US,) I'm happy to acknowledge the Liberals' past misdeeds and don't think that what they did was right. That's quite different from "we are justified in doing x, y, or zed because the Liberals did it first."

    Surely parliament and government should be held to a higher standard.

  • sourstud

    Okay, so you're a Canadian living abroad who's criticizing Conrad Black for living abroad for a short part of his life, while at the same time defending Michael Ignatieff for living abroad most of his life? Too much for me to try to comprehend there.

    But I agree that "parliament and government should be held to a higher standard". Which is why we should all be happy that Conrad Black is not running for parliament. Iggy, on the other hand thinks he deserves to be PM!

  • Canuck237503

    For the record, I have no problem with Iggy having lived a long time abroad. It shouldn't be a disqualification from high office. What, we only want people who've never left the country to be eligible for office? If you can prove to me that he has no understanding of the country or its institutions (and not the talking point of "he's out of touch with ordinary Canadians" nonsense; I could make that argument about most of Parliament), then we can talk. But there's no evidence of that.

    And let's keep in mind that Black didn't just switch countries. While in Canada and then UK/US, he routinely derided Canada as a near third-world backwater and praised the US and UK. Then, after he went to prison in the US, he saw the light and became a big Canada defender and critic of the US. I find that highly entertaining and worthy of a bit of teasing (which my post was meant to be doing).

    I did use your comment as a bootstrap on the fact that the Tory response to EVERYTHING (whether Black/Iggy or their current abuses) is just "The Liberals Did it Too." I didn't really think it relevant to Iggy/Black, but it was a convenient excuse :-)

    And let me also note, as someone who went to grade school with Conrad Black's son, I can tell you that the family is VERY out of touch with ordinary Canadians (though what on earth an "ordinary Canadian" is defined at is quite beyond me.)

  • Kaplan

    Yeah, but his vocabulary is totally fromuntatious!

  • OriginalEmily1

    Actually he's just rude.

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